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Magnus Carlsen vs Loek van Wely
Aerosvit (2008), Foros UKR, rd 3, Jun-10
Semi-Slav Defense: General (D43)  ·  1-0



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Given 12 times; par: 108 [what's this?]

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Kibitzer's Corner
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 5 OF 5 ·  Later Kibitzing>
Jun-10-08  cuendillar: <Now it's off to Spain-Russia (currently 1-0)..> Scored by Shirov against Jakovenko yesterday.
Jun-10-08  Tomlinsky: That was a rather slick display by the young 'un, very nicely played. <Udit Narayan> A similar thought crossed my mind.
Jun-10-08  groupoid: What could be the purpose of 38..g4?
Jun-10-08  groupoid: Van Wely played very well except for that move (in time trouble)
Jun-10-08  JohnBoy: I don't understand 22...Bb6. Does black really have to give back a pawn here?
Premium Chessgames Member
  tamar: <groupoid: What could be the purpose of 38..g4?>

Exactly right.

Van Wely spent most of the previous moves putting his pawns on dark colored squares and then this move!

Premium Chessgames Member
  tamar: Must be dispiriting for Van Wely that his 17 year old opponent calmly goes for an equal ending, and then turns into Lasker.

<JohnBoy> if 22...f6 23 Nd3 Bb6 24 Nf4 Rd8 25 Rxd8 Bxb8 26 Nxe6 Bb6 the position is curiously similar to the game. If he tries to hold onto the e pawn with 24...e5 25 Ne6 Kh8 26 Nxg7 wins the g pawn.

Premium Chessgames Member
  tamar: <They have reached move 24 by now, and there is that many pieces left. The position is fairly equal according to commentators but I expect Magnus to put some pressure on Loek in the endgame :-)>

From Henrik Carlsen's blog

Jun-10-08  Ulhumbrus: An alternative to 24...Rxd7 is 24...Bb7 and after 25 Rxc7? Bxc7 26 Nd7 Bc8 27 Nc5 Black has had time to get his QB back into play. Now 27...Kf7 begins to get ready for ...e5. However on 24...Bb7 White has 25 Rd8+! Kh7 26 Be4+ On 38 f4 instead of 38...g4, 38...exf4 39 exf4 gxf4 40 gxf4 Be6 41 Bg6 Bd5 may draw
Jun-10-08  zanshin: <JohnBoy>

M Carlsen - L Van Wely, Aerosvit 0:23:33-0:02:33 2008

click for larger view

Analysis by Rybka 2.3 mp 32-bit (22-ply):

1. = (0.07): 22...f6 23.Ng6 e5 24.Ne7+ Bxe7 25.Rxe7 a5 26.Kf1 Rd8 27.b3 a4 28.bxa4 bxa4 29.Bc4+

2. = (0.17): 22...Bb6 23.Nxf7 Rc7 24.Nxh6+ gxh6 25.Rd8+ Kg7 26.Rxa8 Rd7 27.Bg4 Rd2 28.b3 Rxa2 29.Kf1

3. (0.42): 22...Rf8 23.Bg4 f5 24.Ng6 Re8 25.Bh5 Bb6 26.Ne5 Rf8 27.Re7 Rd8 28.h4 c5 29.Bf7+

4. (0.61): 22...Re8 23.Nxf7 Re7 24.Nxh6+ gxh6 25.Rd8+ Kg7 26.Rxa8 Rd7 27.g4 Rd2 28.Kf1 Rxb2 29.Rc8

5. (0.61): 22...Rb8 23.Nxf7 Rb7 24.Nxh6+ gxh6 25.Rd8+ Kg7 26.Rxa8 Rd7 27.g4 Rd2 28.Kf1 Rxb2 29.Rc8

Jun-10-08  hardliner: The game of the day on ICC by GM Larry Christiansen: Chess
Jun-10-08  ajile: 26.Nc5! maintains the blockade on Black's bad LSB on a8. Carlsen plays a beautiful strategic game here. Black's bad bishop seems to seriously question the playability of this formation with pawns on c6-b5 and LSB trapped behind them.
Premium Chessgames Member
  Jimfromprovidence: What did the pundits say about 38…g4? That looks like the critical move. Instead, after 38…exf4 39 exf4 gxf4 40 gxf4 Be6, below, the position looks pretty even.

click for larger view

If white’s king moves to support the advance of his f pawn, then black has b4, creating his own passed pawn.

Jun-10-08  PinkPanther: The notion that Van Wely is a Super GM worthy of playing in tournaments like this needs to be dispelled. Look up his score against any contemporary Super GM that you can think of....I dare you. From now on, when he gets invitations to Super GM Tournaments it should read like this: "Hey Loek, we need somebody for everybody else to beat up on...wanna play?".
Jun-10-08  OneArmedScissor: <PinkPanther>

I fully agree.

Jun-11-08  natrix75: Moves 17-25 was quite a blood bath.
Jun-11-08  zluria: <pinkpanther> Van wely is -7 +6 =13 against Svidler, but has catastrophic scores against Leko and Shirov
Jun-11-08  Alphastar: <PinkPanther> We all know he isn't a "Super GM". I have no idea whether that notion ever existed either. However, if you wanted to hate on him, you could always send him an email.
Jun-11-08  achieve: Interesting comment by Henrik C.

"During the game commentators said that the endgame would be easy to draw for black, probably due to the computer evaluations. And maybe it was relatively easy, I don't know.

The interesting point is that the computer analysis available obviously distorts the realism of spectators and commentators with regard to what is easy or not so easy to find over the board in time pressure in the 4th or 5th hour of the game. As we have seen many many times, in practical play even top players go astray in seemingly "easy" endgames and this is one of the aspects making competitive chess interesting." -- of course from

Jun-11-08  euripides: <Jim> Dimitrov agrees with you on the chessdom link given by minasina.

In your diagram I would have thought White might have some chances by playing the king to e5 when his king can support the f pawn while the black king cannot support the b pawn - a difference that is often decisive in rook and pawn endings. If Black plays the bishop to a2 to shepherd the b pawn home then after b3 White can pin along the a2-g8 diagonal. Black has to cope with the f pawn as well as protecting c6.

Jun-11-08  PinkPanther: <zluria>
Keep looking. There are a lot more results than just those that support my claim.

The only leg Van Wely has to stand on is the fac that he's from the Netherlands. If you get an invitation every year to a Super Tournaent, like Van Wely does with Wijk, then you should be a Super GM. He obviously isn't. For what it's worth, it bothers me just as much when Naiditsch is invited to Dortmund year after year....and he's not even German, or when Vallejo was always invited to Linares.

Jun-11-08  Whack8888: I always enjoy playing the White side of the Moscow variation here. Very popular seems to be 6. Bh4 which leads to very complicated positions, but White gets a lot in my opinion by giving up the Bishop pair, and I find the positions very fun to play.
Jun-17-08  zanshin: Good explanation of the main points in this game:

Youtube link:

or link:

Jul-06-17  Dave12: A very impressive game, starts from an unusual (but typical!) opening choice, where white is foreseeing the small initiative against the pair of bishops in the long endgame.
Oct-25-21  DouglasGomes: Position after 27. Bg4
<SF: -0.16 d49> 27.... Bd6 28.Nxe6 c5 29.Nf4 g5 30.Ne2 Be5 31.b3 Bd5 32.f4 Bb2 33.Bf3 Be6 34.Kf2 c4 35.fxg5 hxg5 36.b4 c3 37.Nd4 Bxa2
28. Bxe6+?? Ke7 loses material simply
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