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Magnus Carlsen vs Teimour Radjabov
Pearl Spring Chess Tournament (2009), Nanjing CHN, rd 5, Oct-02
Sicilian Defense: Nezhmetdinov-Rossolimo Attack (B30)  ·  1-0

ANALYSIS [x]

FEN COPIED

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Kibitzer's Corner
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 17 OF 18 ·  Later Kibitzing>
Oct-02-09  DeepTrouble: <kingscrusher: Natalia: In that possible endgame which could have happed after the Nxc5 variation, is this better for White:>

I did an analysis using Deep Rybka 3 (with 6 piece endgame databases) in this position and its evaluation heavily favours white: The score starts at 2.22 but increases steadily (white ends up with B+2P vs N and a clearly winning position). I tried several alternative lines but all lead to a win for white.


click for larger view

Analysis by Deep Rybka 3 x64 (8 core):

31...g5 32.h4 g4 33.f3 g3 34.Bb4 Kg7 35.Be1 Kg6 36.Bxg3 Ne7 37.Kf1 Nc6 38.Ke2 (2.22) Depth: 28

I disagree with Natalie's view that Rybka "can't be trusted" and that engines "don't understand" these kind of positions: In my experience (based on analyses of hundreds of games between 2700+ rated players) Rybka plays (in general) more accurate endgames than strong GMs.

However, it's important to equip Rybka with endgame databases, as it will improve her endgame evaluations (more accuracy) and speed up her searches (if there are P pieces left and you're using a P piece EGTB, you'll get perfect evaluations as well). Without these tablebases she will misevaluate certain endgames more often.

Oct-02-09  beenthere240: <eyal> In the variation you give after 23...Bxf2+ ending with 29...Qxd3, could white play 30 Rd1 (instead of e5)?
Oct-02-09
Premium Chessgames Member
  Eyal: <beenthere240> Yeah, I should have mentioned that - after 30.Rd1:


click for larger view

It might seem as if White is winning (if the black queen moves then 31.d7 forks the rooks), but Black has the nice resource of 30...Ra8!

Oct-02-09  ROADDOG: 23.Nxb5 blows me away. Evidently, Radjabov also. Congrats to Carlsen for finding the moves and a great win.
Oct-02-09  traction: love the position of all the knights after white's move 24 Nxc5...
Oct-02-09  rubicante: looks like carlsen really improved, but his results against kramnik are not very good. I wonder who will win in their next match.
Oct-02-09  beenthere240: <eyal> Thanks, I completely missed that.
Oct-02-09  ontocaustic: what is carlsen's muscle mass, some say that it has improved in some ways the muscle mass of players from the 40s and 50s will be greater because there was less motorized ways to move and but i am not sure they could conquer carlsen
Oct-02-09
Premium Chessgames Member
  HeMateMe: Its fun to watch MC play like this. Radja paid a price for castling way too late. I wonder how far away Carlsen saw how the Bishop, after chasing away the Rook on d8, would put in a dangerous attack on a queenside piece? Im always wondering how far in advance they can see these things.
Oct-02-09  rogge: <Natalia Pogonina: 19.Bg5 Rc8 20.Nfd4 Nb2 21.Qe2 Nc4 22.Rfc1 and Black is in serious trouble>

Congratulations, that's an incredibly precise analysis!

Oct-02-09  tacticalmonster: incrediaby both white knight are immune to capture on move 24.

1) Qxc5 Nd6
2) Rxc5 Be7 Rxb5 Bxf8 Kxf8 Qxc4
3) Qxb5 Be7 Re8 Qxc4 Qxc4 Rxc4 Rxe7 Rxb4 (Rxc5?? Ra8+)

Oct-02-09  A Karpov Fan: A brilliant game by Carlsen, lets hope the boy winder can keep it up in the second half :-)
Oct-02-09  Aiuta: <
rogge: <Natalia Pogonina: 19.Bg5 Rc8 20.Nfd4 Nb2 21.Qe2 Nc4 22.Rfc1 and Black is in serious trouble>

Congratulations, that's an incredibly precise analysis!>

easy one, severl pepole suggested that line over here. dont have to be pregnatnt to suggest an obvisous cont.

Oct-02-09  rogge: <easy one, severl pepole suggested that line over here. dont have to be pregnatnt to suggest an obvisous cont.>

Too bad Rabjadov isn't as good as you guys :)

Oct-02-09
Premium Chessgames Member
  tamar: Judging from Radjabov's clock times, he saw it coming too, but could hardly believe there was no way out.

Castling was a final sign of disbelief, and he had no heart to continue.

Oct-02-09  A Karpov Fan: This has to be the best super-tournament start since Karpov in Linares 1994 going +6 after 6 rounds and winning +9=4 in the end!!

But will Carlsen stay undefeated...

Oct-02-09  Abdooss: <GM Ray Keene> yes, I had read your articles about Korchnoi and Gazza.. in various tournaments, when they gained that <momentum>, they never let go, thus winning in great margin.
Oct-02-09  twoinchgroup: raykeene,

Your conclusions about this match are skewed and misplaced in my opinion. Carlsen's win is not the result of "momentum" or "peculiar mystique" !?!?!? CARLESEN'S win came as the direct result of moves such as 3.Bb5, 9.e5, 12.a4, 19.Bg5, 21.Qe2, Nxb5! and Nxc5 all of which none of us Kibitzing here would make/find over the board in response to 1...c5. Rather, one could rightly assume that, while sitting down to this game, Carlsen was more confident and even buoyant as a result of the previous three wins thus giving HIMSELF some mental/physical momentum. HOWEVER, let us NOT dismiss the brilliance he displayed today over the board by replacing it with some fanciful idea that somehow chess games are not won one move at a time. Such malformed indulgences on your part simply diminish the luster of an obvious master-piece. A boost in his own confidence does not move the white pieces sans his own brain and will.

Additionally, to others of you, I liken your use of Rybka and other similar programs to CRITIQUE a match like this to be similar to comparing a photo to a painting. Although the photo can be a more accurate rendering of a subject it pales in comparison to the artists rendering (the master painters eye)every time. Why? Because as chess players we aspire to be "master artist/painters" NOT "photographers". So lets be more discrete in the use of computers to analyze these positions lest we miss the simple beauty of a particular masters stroke. Likewise, lets be sure we don't equate the regurgitation of Rybka analysis with our own intelligence/insight.

Oct-02-09  twoinchgroup: <Most of today's players would get creamed by the generation of players that emerged in the 40's and 50's...> What complete, unprovable, immeasurable, illogical nonsense.

Whitehat1963,

I agree 100% with you!!! Not only is birthtimes observation ridiculous here but birthtimes is the penultimate "Captain Obvious"!!! Read his other comments and be prepared...amazing! Its almost embarrassing to read his stuff.

Oct-02-09  Softpaw: <twoinchgroup: raykeene,

Your conclusions about this match are skewed and misplaced in my opinion. Carlsen's win is not the result of "momentum" or "peculiar mystique" !?!?!? CARLESEN'S win came as the direct result of moves such as 3.Bb5, 9.e5, 12.a4, 19.Bg5, 21.Qe2, Nxb5! and Nxc5 all of which none of us Kibitzing here would make/find over the board in response to 1...c5. >

Huh? Nobody here could find 3.Bb5? What are you talking about?

Ray Keene wrote: <...radjabov came out of the opening fine but then overrreached...>

How is that not true?

Oct-03-09  Notagm: Twoinchgroup: do you even know the rules of chess? Any your analogy between a photographer and a painter seems rather off point.
Oct-03-09
Premium Chessgames Member
  Eyal: What happened to Radjabov in this game is a textbook example of the dangers of trying to initiate an attack before completing development. On the other hand, note how the series of strong moves played by Carlsen in the crucial phase of the game - 17.Nb3, 19.Bg5, 22.Rfc1 - are all natural developing moves, mobilizing all of White's forces into play. (The rook on a1 didn't have to be "developed", because after the opening of the a-file with 12.a4-13.axb5 it became a significant force in the game without moving.)
Oct-03-09  karik: The official site report (Review of Oct.2nd):

... "Radjabov (black) changed his move at step 10 which was not approved by Carlsen. At step 15 and 16, the black side made a steep move, which was blew by the white side with a series of tactics. Black lost a piece because of the omission in step 22, and Radjabov threw in the sponge."

As far as I know you are not allowed to change your move, so no wonder Carlsen disapproved it. Does anyone know what move Rad did try instead of Qb6? I also don't know if steep moves are allowed. And finally, throwing sponges is unprecedented. I wonder if anyone was hurt.

Oct-03-09  Jim Bartle: That's a pretty entertaining translation.
Oct-03-09  AnalyzeThis: Games like this make you appreciate Karpov in his prime playing a super solid line of the Caro Kann and reliably putting a half point up on the board with black.
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