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Marcos Llaneza-Vega vs Ricardo Brosa Alvarez
Asturias-ch (2004), Oviedo, rd 6, Mar-19
French Defense: McCutcheon. Lasker Variation (C12)  ·  1-0

ANALYSIS [x]

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Kibitzer's Corner
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 2 OF 2 ·  Later Kibitzing>
Oct-07-14  Bubo bubo: 33.Rxc8+ Kxc8 34.Nd6+, and Black loses either his king (34...Kb8 35. Qb7#) or his queen.
Oct-07-14  M.Hassan: <diagonally>, <gofer> & <morfishine>

Thanks for very nice comments. I saw 33.Rxc8+ line but failed to see the continuation and I quite agree that it is a more forcing line. As a similie, I can say that the text line is like the bite of a dangrous venomous snake that kills fast but my line is like an annaconda wrapping around the prey and killing the prey by asphyxiation.

<morfishine: However, better is 34.Rxc8 34...Ka7/b7 35.Qd7+ forcing mate....> You probably mean 33.Rxc8 Ka7/b7 . King can not go to b7

Oct-07-14  Willber G: <newzild: I went for the first win I saw, which was 33. Qd8. After Qh5+ 34. Ke1, Black has no more checks.>

What about 34...Qe5+

Oct-07-14  dfcx: 33.? white to move, easy.

The black bishop is protecting the king, removing it with 33. Rxc8+ Kxc8
34. Nd6+ Qxd6 (Kb8?? 35. Qb7#)
35. Qxd6

Oct-07-14  morfishine: <M.Hassan> Very good, but I'm not sure of what you mean by 'King cannot go to b7'

Looks like he can

Oct-07-14  stacase: Wham Bam!

Forced all the way.

Only took a few seconds to make sure it all worked.

Oct-07-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  kevin86: The rook sac at c8 works. White either mates in three or wins black's queen for a rook.
Oct-07-14  HowDoesTheHorsieMove: I saw the Rxc8 line. I found this easier than yesterday, but I did have to think about whether to call a queen against a rook a win.
Oct-07-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  Domdaniel: Much as it pains me to do this to the French, I saw the entire winning line in a second or two.

Oh well. As a committed French player, it helps to see one's opponent's possibilities.

Oct-07-14  pericles of athens: First line I considered wins. 33. Rxc8 1-0
Oct-07-14  M.Hassan: <morfishine :<M.Hassan> Very good, but I'm not sure of what you mean by 'King cannot go to b7'>

If 33.Rxc8+
King has to take the Rook because White Queen is sitting on e7.

Am I missing something?

Oct-07-14  Castleinthesky: This puzzle is a good example of the "distraction" tactic, where the sac of a piece forces another piece to move to a disadvantageous (usually mating square).
Oct-07-14  BOSTER: <Domdaniel: As a commited French player ,it helps to see>.

In Anderssen's era in the pos. black to play 23...(diagram).


click for larger view

Everybody would play 23...Bd7 sacr. the rook.

If 24.Qxa8 d3 25.cxd3 Ba4+ 26.Kc1 Qe1+ 27.Kb2 Qxe2+ 28.Ka3 Qxd3+ 29.Kxa4 Qd4+ 30.Ka3 Qc3+ 31.Ka4 Qxa1 and black is better.

Oct-07-14  Chess Dad: <M. Hassan> and <morfishine>:

You two are talking past each other.

Yes, if 33. Rxc8+ then Ka7 is illegal.

However, if 33. Qe8 Rxb5 34. Rxc8+ Ka(b)7 35. Qd7+ Ka6 36. Ra8#.

Both variations force a fairly easy win of the black queen. In the first, the black queen must take Nd6 on move 34 to avoid the mate, in the second, the black queen must take Rc5 on move 33.

From that point, I'm sure there's a forced checkmate, eventually, but it's beyond the range of stockfish within a minute or two. (Though both score in the +9 or so range.)

Oct-07-14  David2009: I am coming very late to this particular party (M Llaneza-Vega vs R Brosa Alvarez, 2004 White 33):


click for larger view

I looked at 33.Rxc8+ and, like <Once>, could not quickly spot the follow-up so went with 33. Qe8 stopping Black checks and it seemed to me winning. I am pleased to see from the kibitzes, notably from <M.Hassan>, that it does do so. Unlike <Once>, I did not find the follow-up to Rxc8+ until I saw the game.

<Once> asks why he didn't spot it straight away. In my case I put it down to age (I am seventy-two) and the brain gets less plastic. If chess is all about pattern recognition, there is a limit to the number of patterns one can store or new patterns one can create. The pattern in this game is relatively unfamiliar.

Oct-07-14  patzer2: Today's Tuesday puzzle is easily solved in two moves by 33. Rxc8+! Kxc8 34. Nd6+! , which forces Black to surrender Queen for Knight to avoid mate.

However, there seems to be an alternative solution with 34. Qe8+!? which, though not as strong as 34. Nd6+! offers an interesting and highly instructive look at the possibilities in a ♕ and ♖ versus ♕ and ♘ middle game to end game transition.

One possibility played out move-by-move with Fritz is 34. Qe8+!? Kb7 35. Qd7+ Ka6

35... ♔a8 36. ♕c6+! ♔b8 37. ♕xb6+ ♔c8 38. ♘d6+ ♔d7 39. ♕b7+ ♔xd6 (39... ♔d8 40. ♕c8+ ♔e7 41. ♕c7+ ♔f6 42. ♕f7#) 40. ♕b8+ ♔d7 41. ♕xe5

36. Nc7+ Kb7 37. Nxd5+ Kb8 38. Qd8+ Kb7 39. Qxb6+ Kc8 40. Qxa5 Qd4+ 41. Qd2 Qg4+ 42. Qe2 Qd4+ 43. Qd3 Qg4+ 44. Kd2 exd5 45. Qxd5 Qxh4 46. Qc5+ Kb8 47. a3 to .

Oct-07-14  Muztang: <Once> : It's a nice try, but I don't think it works. Sorry.

Thanks! ;-)

Oct-07-14  paavoh: Seemed pretty straightforward to me. Rxc8+, Nd6+, and Qb7 mate or winning a Queen at d6.
Oct-07-14  paavoh: @Domdaniel: I felt your pain too, but Black was, it seems, at the same time, too greedy for White pawns and played meek defensive moves.

BOSTER's suggestion about distracting the White Queen is very good.

Oct-07-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  Penguincw: Not the easiest Tuesday puzzle ever, but I came up with it. :)
Oct-07-14  mistreaver: Tuesday. White to play. Easy. 33?
33 Rxc8 Kxc8
34 Nd6+ and now either
34... Qxd6
35 Qxd6
and
34... Kb8
35Qb7 mate
therefore best move is
34... resigns.
Oct-07-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  chrisowen: Skin sew c8 in ha homily mohair sheen bright,

free club rook river tickle c8 off in a vow sense koinus agreed a bug hone for one i efface off dead ducky in cad flight rook glean bind every huffle along a do cop to sac ever aim good a guffaw i c8 in dug a dip too dum bell clerk aim a4 bad head a cutoff pawn hog i alive no more a giveof aim deed b8 a king done am con foil c8 first rook as in c8 wheel in fatefuls a line better glide of arm i b5 in d6 a surge act a4,

mistakes select ogle a mind to blow over now fabric free try am c3 rook and i along rook among rale try cot beds c8 after guild arm a 31...a4 fed also definate dog in dig fled and fleeced b8 freed d6 farced define ogle a mint e5 deface boot blocks a path in try confide c8 feared and faired the consequences opportune a query d6 crescent rook i moon faired knight betel nut vision a plump d6 also aims acts above duties around his station acts and asks e5 the question where to stop ignoble hive spark imminent i mate in effect aids and abet b5 and fan pan around knight queen has to trade off over e5 splendid pan again a dip,

add a4 in fade on deaf ears b5 posted faced and fared flared up on time cadaver b8 at im liking a b8 out of sorts dead body down the river d6 gold inca ok came light d6 as near next in tempt d6 hop along cassidy goal keep plug b5 tell aint hood affable flush aorta tag and bag oh of the fashion a hoof along d6 cattle e7 prod you see free team rook shoo away in push at sorry in cat i 31...Qf4 of lyeth a nine tail lay decist e7 fly de form an de face fold space d6 fair enough farm b5 fled jaw force an feel b5 find ford a d6 frets over d6 fear off good b5 growed affable dang,

affinity ramble give your honor d6 as put suffix along free cliff at dig cad fly for man dutiful b8 at post a bridge faced the truth ive free call of the wild canyon c8 off good stuff of gland fresh e7 queen apt a4 bad cap 33.Rxc8+ back in,

asp i cable wire bus black carks again business at hand brick by b8 brick an build gets dismantled cabby over batch again would d6 as win delicate rook e5 queen has to be sacced knight wins a fetch in c8 first block and tackle churlish free changing the picture c8 in elevates landscape creepin c8 a null arm b8 caustics again,

vow corridor chest er e8 up a king queen for a day both d8 also band ive cautions abound coupling trim b5 lance d6 hoof since huffle an shuffle b8 he cuff in chef rake on b8 lack man joins the party ramble c8 in cull accustom in a tour accents on light o prove d6 a foregone queen conclusion accrued by degree c8 at do tick tack,

and toe the lines b6 ash a linch rook for a pin c8 punch in carte blanche commoned goal cabs at free cascadence at hill b5 hash am rock king aim branched off a4 blah phooey shin rook chip aint king in b8 sling your hook a line low good b5 you go d6 through c8 a till fare marbled c8 hall b5 an d6 fares ever e5 well train d6 has rightly left the station maybe in contacts to reach c8 steal a march continues and make creakers abound knight bed flow chocabloc rook escape a chestnut stick of see b5 hick d6 or why e5 chortles again over aim ash 33...Kxe8 34.Nd6+ wins a d6 queen off three points ahead train station c8 evermore queen d6 won

Oct-07-14  morfishine: <M.Hassan> NP, I was referring to your line starting with <33.Qe8> followed by 33...Rxb5 and now I was noting that 34.Rxc8+ is better than 34.Qxc8+

The game continuation is <33.Rxc8+> :)

Oct-07-14
Premium Chessgames Member
  Longview: Recognizing that I must check the black king or be attacked nonstop motivated me to consider abandoning my first thoughts of N-d6, my first instinctual move. Realizing that I could sacrifice the rook and still keep the check going via the same Knight move gave me the answer. Some forcing situations force one to come to the right conclusion....given time.
Oct-07-14  M.Hassan: <morfishine:<M.Hassan> NP, I was referring to your line starting with <33.Qe8> followed by 33...Rxb5 and now I was noting that 34.Rxc8+ is better than 34.Qxc8+ The game continuation is <33.Rxc8+> :)>

Right! Thank you, in your original message 33...Rxb5 was not mentioned and that's why I got puzzled. The game continuation is 34.Rxc8+
Thanks again, cleared now:)

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