< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 6 OF 6 ·
|Jan-14-20|| ||torrefan: gotta wear shades|
|Jan-14-20|| ||Fusilli: Sometime soon I plan to edit his bio. There is too much about the 2016 World Youth Chess Olympiad, including other players' results, that I plan to clean up.|
Inviting proposals on information you think should be in his bio and is not there already. Any input?
|Jan-14-20|| ||EdwinKorir: Wesley So puts some reality check on Alireza. This is where his chess learning begins. You can not go for wins all the time against the best in the world.|
|Jan-16-20|| ||EdwinKorir: Wait till Alireza plays a Super Grandmaster they said; then he clears Giri.|
|Jan-18-20|| ||ketchuplover: There is no chess future for this boy|
|Jan-18-20|| ||ndg2: KirilOutAlirezaIn|
|Jan-18-20|| ||0o0o0o0o0: This is the guy. Chess is full of the prodigy and like Wei Yi they fall short, but there is something about this guy. He has a bite about him, an attitude that will take his obvious talents right up to the top. When he hits 20 we will know what he is all about but for now he is the only one since Carlsen where I have thought, oh aye!|
|Jan-18-20|| ||AylerKupp: <<EdwinKorir> Wait till Alireza plays a Super Grandmaster they said; then he clears Giri.>|
When did Giri become a Super Grandmaster? ;-) Seriously, on what basis is a GM considered a super GM? Tournament results? Rating? If the later, what's the threshold? If 2700+ is the threshold (a commonly used criteria) then in the 3rd round Firouzja defeated Artemiev who had a pre-tournament rating of 2731, not too far behind Giri's pre-tournament rating of 2768. And after 7 rounds both Artemiev and Giri have the same 3.5/7 score, the same as Carlsen and Anand.
Let's see how he does against Carlsen in round 9 and Anand in round 11 (not to mention future tournaments) before we start proclaiming him the second coming of AlphaZero. Fortunately for Firouzja he has White against both of them, just like he did against Artemiev and Giri, and after 7 rounds White has won 17 out of the 18 decisive games, so that is in his favor. Maybe it's the water in Wijk aan Zee?
|Jan-19-20|| ||ndg2: My prediction: a loss(!) in round 9 against Carlsen who must and will finally awaken from his winter slumber, but a win(!) against Anand in round 11. Also tough will also be round 10 (black against Caruana). I see a second loss likely there. Not sure about round 8 (black against a strong J. van Foreest who may count as the true tournement surprise given his 2650-ish ELO). Everything possible there. Vitiugov and Dubov are beatable opponents, but let's not get carried away. One point of the last two rounds wouldn't be bad either.|
That is: I see a score of 2.5 to 3.5 points out of the last 6 rounds for Firouzja but not more. 8.5/13 would still be tremendous for a first time participant.
|Jan-19-20|| ||Pulo y Gata: Alireza is the only player Carlsen fears|
|Jan-19-20|| ||fisayo123: Let's not predict losses now. Firouzja is perfectly capable of a surprise against anyone.|
|Jan-19-20|| ||beatgiant: <AylerKupp>
You're right, there is no official definition of "super-GM".
In another thread on another page, someone proposed a criterion for super-GM like "a player who remains in the top 10 for at least 3 years." Obviously this re-opens our long simmering debate whether "top N" should use a fixed N or should scale with the population of chessplayers, but that's another story.
Giri played in the Candidates in 2016 and made an even score, was Kramnik's second for the 2018 Candidates, and will be in the 2020 Candidates, and based on those qualifications I'd call him a super-GM. If not, then who do you think is a super-GM, and why?
|Jan-21-20|| ||Caissanist: I always thought that the best definition of a pre-FIDE "grandmaster" came from Conel Hugh O'Donel Alexander 50 years ago: "somebody who might reasonably be expected to play a match for the world championship". These days I think of that as being a good definition of "super GM". Of course this is vague and open to argument, but I believe most people would agree that Giri has been in that category for several years now, while Artemiev hasn't, yet.|
|Jan-21-20|| ||fabelhaft: <"somebody who might reasonably be expected to play a match for the world championship". These days I think of that as being a good definition of "super GM">|
Rather harsh definition though. Players like MVL, Mamedyarov and Nepomniachtchi are maybe not expected to play a title match, but not calling them super GMs would feel wrong.
|Jan-21-20|| ||alexmagnus: <"somebody who might reasonably be expected to play a match for the world championship">|
For that we don't need a new term, we already have one: Candidate (that is, somebody who has ever played a Candidates tournament. After all, the "Candidates" in Candidates Tournament stays for "candidate for a world championship match").
|Jan-21-20|| ||alexmagnus: Also, pre-FIDE grandmaster meant simply somebody who has won an international tournament.|
|Jan-21-20|| ||fabelhaft: <<"somebody who might reasonably be expected to play a match for the world championship">|
For that we don't need a new term, we already have one: Candidate (that is, somebody who has ever played a Candidates tournament>
But Pilnik, Panno, Filip, Olafsson and Benko were maybe not expected to play a title match after all
|Jan-21-20|| ||alexmagnus: They became candidates too late :)
As I noted on the Carlsen page, all (undisputed) world champions born after 1930 played their first Candidates tournament at the age 22 or earlier.
|Jan-21-20|| ||alexmagnus: Where world champions born after 1930 were in the year they turned 22:|
Tal in 1958: qualified for his first Candidates
Spassky in 1959: had one Candidates tournament (1956) behind him
Fischer in 1965: had two Candidates tournaments (1959, 1962) behind him
Karpov in 1973: qualified for his first Candidates
Kasparov in 1985: became world champion
Kramnik in 1996: had one Candidates tournament (1994) behind him. Also played FIDE Candidates in the same year.
Anand in 1991: played his first Candidates
Carlsen in 2012: had one Candidates tournament (2007) behind him.
|Jan-21-20|| ||alexmagnus: With Tal and Karpov still being 22 when the Candidates they qualified for started.|
|Jan-21-20|| ||Caissanist: <alexmagnus> There was no commonly agreed definiton of "grandmaster" before FIDE formalized the title in 1950. Supposedly the term was first coined to honor the five finalists in St. Petersburg 1914, though this may be apocryphal.|
|Jan-21-20|| ||alexmagnus: < Supposedly the term was first coined to honor the five finalists in St. Petersburg 1914, though this may be apocryphal.>|
This <is> apocryphal, as in the invitation to the tournament <only grandmasters> were invited!
|Jan-21-20|| ||Caissanist: <fabelhaft> I don't think any of the players you mentioned would be more unreasonable a WC challenger than Karjakin or Gelfand were. I guess you could say "reasonable person to play a WC match" could mean at least as well established as those two were.|
|Jan-21-20|| ||fabelhaft: <I don't think any of the players you mentioned would be more unreasonable a WC challenger than Karjakin or Gelfand were>|
Karjakin and Gelfand won a bunch of super tournaments. Gelfand was top three behind only Kasparov and Karpov in 1990-91 and Karjakin was very much predicted to play for the title. I don't think players like Pilnik and Filip ever were at the same level as them.
|Jan-21-20|| ||anandrulez: Here is a nice lecture on Firouzja's 2019 games by GM Denes Boros: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5NN...|
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