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Feb-10-24
 | | beatgiant: Robert Byrne's NYT column of Oct. 13, 1985 refers to Spraggett as an International Master. |
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Feb-10-24
 | | Sally Simpson: Just passing by but found this.
"In 1985 he [Kevin Spraggett] finally won the Commonwealth Championship in London, overtaking all the leading Brits, for which he attained the title of grandmaster. " that was from The Chess Federation of Russia, https://ruchess.ru/en/persons_of_da... That tournament is here; Commonwealth Championship (1985) |
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Feb-10-24 | | stone free or die: <beat> good bit of datum to note. But the question I have is if FIDE holds a session for the awarding - which could mean there's an interregnum where the player is qualified but awaiting the actual awarding. |
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Feb-10-24
 | | beatgiant: <Sally Simpson>
Byrne's column of Apr. 2, 1985 says that Spraggett received only his first grandmaster norm from the Commonwealth Championship. <stone free or die>
True, there is always a period of time after achieving the qualifications while FIDE considers the application for the title. |
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Feb-10-24
 | | beatgiant: Byrne's columns claim the following:
Apr. 2, 1985 column - Spraggett's first norm from Commonwealth Championship (1985) Apr. 16, 1985 column - Spraggett's second norm from Lugano Open (1985) I don't find mention of the third norm in this source. |
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Feb-10-24
 | | OhioChessFan: What's up with the link to his blog page? |
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Feb-10-24 | | stone free or die: <beat> - hmmm, I better go back to the library. I think I missed those (no excuse, I was in a rush as they were closing). Was his performance at Taxco qualifying? |
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Feb-10-24
 | | beatgiant: <OhioChessFan> Only the wordpress one is still up, so I've removed the other links. |
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Feb-10-24 | | stone free or die: Here's his old domain site on Wayback (<http://www.kevinspraggett.com>) https://web.archive.org/web/2024000... and his old blogspot blog (<http://kevinspraggett.blogspot.com/>) https://web.archive.org/web/2021061... |
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Feb-11-24 | | FM David H. Levin: <<beatgiant>: Byrne's columns claim the following: Apr. 2, 1985 column - Spraggett's first norm from Commonwealth Championship (1985) Apr. 16, 1985 column - Spraggett's second norm from Lugano Open (1985) I don't find mention of the third norm in this source.> I emailed GM Spraggett today and received confirmation that the events cited in the above-quoted passage furnished his first two GM norms. He said that the third was at Taxco. |
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Feb-11-24
 | | perfidious: Would Spraggett have received the title without the two prior norms or would it have been awarded on the basis of qualifying from Taxco, a la Fischer from Portoroz 1958 or Huebner via Mallorca 1970? |
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Feb-11-24
 | | perfidious: Another point:
<When the GM title was introduced in 1950, it was awarded to 27 players – world champion Mikhail Botvinnik, those who’d qualified or were seeded in the Candidates tournament and also included players who were no longer in their peak but were once of global reckoning. In the next round of revisions, it came to be awarded automatically to players who won the world title and those who qualified from inter-zonal tournaments for the Candidates....> One exception to the above was Bogolyubov, whose nomination for GM was blocked by the Soviets; he received his title in 1951. |
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Feb-11-24
 | | Sally Simpson: Well done Dave, always, if you can, go to the source. Earlier this afternoon I hit a site that said Etienne Bacrot had become the world's youngest GM beating Kevin Spraggett. The wording made it appear Kevin was the world's previous youngest GM. This is the game. K Spraggett vs Bacrot, 1997 I see someone on page two of this thread suggests that maybe FIDE gave Kevin the GM title without any norms because then he was the only non-GM in the FIDE top 100. Kevin Spraggett (kibitz #46) |
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Feb-11-24
 | | perfidious: Had never heard of anyone being awarded the title in the way suggested by <lentil>. The one unconventional method which was familiar took place when Christiansen made GM without ever being an IM in the 1970s, a practice which had never been allowed; under the regulations then in force, I believe if an untitled player made norms sufficient for GM, those were used to award him the title of IM. |
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Feb-11-24
 | | Sally Simpson: Hi Perfidious,
He does say he was not sure, so maybe posted thinking he was entitled to be a GM. (I agree) He certainly played to a GM standard and with the lack of clarity about his norms rumours and guesses are bound to pop up. His blog/column is very good and refreshing. |
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Feb-11-24 | | Granny O Doul: According to Ancestry.com (who despite my quoting them have pissed me off recently with their continually reduced services): "Perhaps from an unrecorded Middle English *spraket or *sprakot a suffixed derivative of sprak ‘lively brisk’ see Sprake . The word is recorded as sprackt spracket ‘smart active brisk; quick ready-witted intelligent sharp’ in the 19th-century dialect of Worcs and Gloucs." |
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Feb-11-24
 | | Sally Simpson: Of course IMOO (In My Opinionated Opinion) Keven was a GM the moment he made the candidates. He is on my list of genuine GM's. If you aint on the list then you aint a GM. Anatoly Karpov (kibitz #5645) Of course the list needs a bit of updating but that was 10 years ago and I've mellowed a bit. No more ranting or squabbling or deliberately taking an opposite view just for the hell of it. Dave, do you have the emails of all the GM's not on my list, if so inform them they are IM's till they make the candidates. Don't sign it, just stamp the FIDE logo on it. |
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Feb-11-24
 | | beatgiant: Thanks, everyone. I have updated his bio to clarify that Taxco was the third GM norm, as the GM title was then norm-based and not related to qualifying for the Candidates. |
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Feb-11-24 | | stone free or die: There's still the question of when the GM title was conferred. Peter's <LA Times> reporting of Dec 1, 1985 still reports him as a IM, at least in his <Montpellier Candidates> game against <Sokolov>. From this I might be led to believe he didn't officially become a GM until early 1986. (The US newspaper coverage of him dropped off the cliff after the Candidates cycle finished - I suppose a check of the Canadian press might yield a few more data points). |
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Feb-11-24 | | stone free or die: <Sally> RE: "real" GM's Anatoly Karpov (kibitz #5645) I was visited by a vision of Walter Brown, who says he's patiently waiting for you upstairs to give you a good ass whooping. |
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Feb-11-24
 | | beatgiant: <stone free or die> Spraggett's FIDE profile gives 1985 as the year of his GM title (but no month or day). If you believe Peters' reporting, it means it must have come in December 1985. |
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Feb-11-24 | | stone free or die: Ah yes, that completes the story then.
PS- speaking of Candidates, worst FIDE profile photo ever? |
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Feb-11-24
 | | perfidious: Spraggett's FIDE card states he was awarded the title in 1985, and it appears the only event he played after Montpellier was the Pere Noel, which is an annual event held in Montreal--not surprisingly--between Christmas and New Year's Day. On another note: one would truly have to work to find a more dreadful photo than that of Spraggett on the card. It is almost as though the person behind the camera caught him after a night out, and a bad one at that. For all the bad press USCF got after putting Rohde on the cover of their magazine wearing a tatty-looking tee shirt, this was worse. |
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Feb-11-24
 | | Sally Simpson: Hi stoney,
Who says I'm going upstairs?
Walter and Tony Miles are on my complementary GM list. I won't post my complementary list as it's bound to upset some of the highly strung thin skinned souls that haunt here. The geeks will demand Deep Blue and Alpha Zero be added and the smart alecs will demand some obscure player nobody has heard off be added.
My lists, my rules.
John Nunn should be on the original list, he qualified but lost a play off, however as I like him he should be added. |
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Feb-13-24 | | stone free or die: < Hi stoney, Who says I'm going upstairs?> Sally, Walter told me he has an all-access pass, so not to worry - he'll find you one way or the other! |
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