< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 775 OF 775 ·
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May-08-25 | | stone free or die: I found this comment on the web:
<I know that atleast in Sweden we write it like, middle name, first name, middle name last name, atleast when we have multiple middle names. I atleast presume that they do the same in Norway, hence Sven being written first.> Is this true? Might that mean Magnus always was his first name? And if not, would a child be given the choice, or would it have been his parents usage? (None of this matters much, but I am a little curious - especially the middle-name ordering convention) |
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May-08-25
 | | Tabanus: <middle-name ordering convention> No such thing in Norway, AFAIK. <parents usage> Could be, in chess events. First name was probably Sven, but I haven't seen his birth certificate. |
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May-08-25 | | stone free or die: Thanks <Tab> (for keeping me on the right track). |
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May-08-25
 | | Sally Simpson: Let's just go with wiki who have 'Bobby Fischer' https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bobby... and Samuel Reshevsky https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samue... Be interesting to see Fischer's FIDE card, his I.D. was 2000016 and could be seen in 2006 but the link is now broken. Bobby Fischer (kibitz #17732) maybe one of you guys who can find things from long ago can show it. It will say Robert James Fischer. |
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May-08-25
 | | jnpope: Found some info on the Hill brothers (W. E. and F. A.): Walter Hill
Francis Hill
Is F A Hill Francis before moving to the US? |
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May-08-25
 | | jnpope: <Sally Simpson: Let's just go with wiki > I like to think we are the source for Wiki, not the other way-around. <Petrosianic: <That's the point of my comparing the diminutive forms, we don't use "Sammy" here for Reshevsky>You may not, but I do. And he used it himself when he was in his 60's. That was the byline on his column: "The Art of Positional Play, by Sammy Reshevsky". If you don't use it, you should.> I think User: Petrosianic presents a valid case for changing Reshevsky to Sammy (but as I said, I'm leaving this to <Tab> to figure out). |
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May-08-25
 | | MissScarlett: For current players it's advisable to stick with their 'official' FIDE names, otherwise it'd be <Mickey Adams>. But if you're dead, you're fair game. |
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May-08-25
 | | Tabanus: "Sammy" sounds a little more strange to Scandinavian ears. Or my ears. I'll leave him to <jnp>! If Sammy, it's Ok with me. |
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May-08-25 | | WilhelmThe2nd: <j> <<jnpope: Can we track down the city in which Johann Gatscha was born?>> The Social Security Numerical Identification Files online give Gatscha's place of birth as <Panten Bohem*, Czechoslovakia>. This is rendered as <Pauten, Tepl, Bohemia, Austria> in his Fam...Search family tree. This would be Pauten, Teplitz District, West Bohemia which is now Poutnov, Cheb District, Karlovy Vary Region, Czech Republic (Pauten is the German name of the town). Johann/John Gatscha's father was Engelbert Gatscha. There is an 1881 reference to him at Pauten here: https://www.google.com/books/editio... |
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May-08-25
 | | jnpope: <Tabanus: "Sammy" sounds a little more strange to Scandinavian ears. Or my ears. I'll leave him to <jnp>!> I'm avoiding bios/names of those who didn't play chess prior to 1914 (I'm drawing a line at the start of commercial airline travel!). This is all on you <Tab>! You opened Pandora's box tampering with Fischer. ;-) |
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May-08-25
 | | jnpope: <WilhelmThe2nd>, Thanks! |
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May-09-25
 | | jnpope: Sadly I cannot access the <Alberta, Canada, Deaths Index, 1870-1970> on Ancy.com with my US only membership. Can someone verify the date and place of death for Carl Erickson? I was able to track him through his movements and I nailed his birth date and location as well as his first and middle names, but confirming that last piece of data eludes me (I do see "Alberta, Canada" but the rest is blurred out). I wish <Phony Benoni> was still around to appreciate the discovery. |
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May-09-25 | | WilhelmThe2nd: In a previous discussion about the identity of the Belgian player L de Rives here (see Biographer Bistro and Biographer Bistro), there was mention of a <Ch. Loyer de Rives> who published a chess magazine at Brussels during the first decade of the twentieth century. Included was a link to a death notice for a <Charles Loyer de Rives> placed in a French newspaper by his wife <Madame Loyer de Rives de Bosredon> in 1923. There is a listing in an 1887 bibliography of a <Marcelin-Laurent de Rives>, also known as <Laurenci de Rives>, who wrote under the pseudonym <Hippolyte Bosredon> or signed his pieces <L. de R.>. His vital dates are give there as born in 1820 at St-Antoine, near Villeneuve-sur-Lot, died on July 18, 1871 at Brussels: https://www.google.com/books/editio... The fact that the chessplayer L de Rives has a game from 1877 here might lead one to eliminate <Marcelin-Laurent de Rives> from any consideration of being him. But things are not so simple... The 1877 game, de Rives vs C Leffmann, 1877, is misdated.
The source given for it is <Deutsche Schachzeitung, 1874, p. 209>. Checking that source (https://www.google.com/books/editio...) we see that it dates the game as being played on 1873.11.17. Also, a Dutch/Belgian genealogy website has three records for a <François Marcelin Hypolite de Rives>; one marriage record for himself and two marriage records for his daughter Hélène: https://www.openarchieven.nl/search... According to these records <François Marcelin Hypolite de Rives> was a resident of Brussels who was born Oct. 24, 1817 at Saint-Antoine, Lot-et-Garonne, FRA, the son of Charles & Catherine Hélène (née du Vignau) de Rives. He married Sophie Caroline Bakelandt, on Nov. 3, 1869 at Brussels. According to his daughter Hélène's first marriage record from 1891, François died on July 17, 1876 at Brussels. (It should be noted that Hélène's second husband's name was <Charles Louis Marie Loyer> and that he was born in 1862 at Pontchâteau, FRA, i.e. around the same time and at the same place as the <Charles Loyer de Rives> mentioned above.) Were <Marcelin-Laurent de Rives>, <François Marcelin Hypolite de Rives>, and the chessplayer L de Rives all the same person? |
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May-09-25
 | | jnpope: <WilhelmThe2nd>, It's a great theory, but can it be proven? <Marcelin-Laurent de Rives> (1820-1871)
Would seem to excluded him due to the (now corrected) game <de Rives vs C Leffmann, 1873>. Unless those birth/death years are wrong. I do find it interesting that he wrote under the name <Hippolyte Bosredon> and that the other name you uncovered is François Marcelin <Hypolite> de Rives (1817-1876). It definitely feels like they could be the same person with the first set of years being an estimate or error. The second set of years would definitely account for the 1873 game vs Leffmann. And if they are indeed the same person then the other nom de plume, <Laurenci de Rives>, would fit the <L de Rives> of the chess player. I know the French used all sorts of noms... nom de terre, nom de plume, nom de guerre, etc., which litter the chess landscape (see Kermur Sire De Legal, Philidor, Louis Charles Mahe De La Bourdonnais, Pierre de Saint-Amant, etc). Seems reasonable to me that the French-Belgians would do the same thing for whatever cultural reason the French did it. |
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May-09-25
 | | jnpope: Tracked down Edward Elliott as well. |
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May-09-25 | | WilhelmThe2nd: <j> re: Carl Erickson I think the Regina address was an old address that the Veterans Administration had for Erickson. (The card for Erickson that gives the Regina address is from the <United States, Veterans Administration Master Index, 1917-1940>. Aside from the notations at the top, the death date is the only part that is hand-written on it.) There is a death notice in the <Edmonton Journal>, 1957.08.03, p20, that says, <"On August 2nd, aged 79 years, Carl Herman Erickson of Government House, Edmonton, Alberta."> According to Wikipedia, the 'Government House' referred to was then being used as a convalescent home for veterans: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gover... |
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May-09-25
 | | jnpope: <WilhelmThe2nd>, thanks for finding that confirming piece. I think that wraps up the open questions I had about Carl Erickson. |
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May-09-25
 | | jnpope: Helge Hokensen "...and moved around a lot before settling in California as a hospital ward assistant." An understatement. I was able to track him through a few years that are absent in <Tab>'s genealogy record. I threw some <History> involving his chess activities for a number of places into his bio and added a couple new games I found along the way. It seems he moved every year or every two years depending upon the whims of the military. |
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May-09-25
 | | jnpope: It can be confusing.
Always submit a player <new to CG> with the full legal name. This allows us to have that information for the biography box. Once a biography gets started the name used for the <long name> and <short name> will get updated to the CG spec for those fields: Game Collection: Individual Player Names The full legal name should always appear in the biography box (when known and a biography is started). The <long name> is what is used by the CG search forms on the homepage and the <short name> is what appears on the search results pages. Then there are names that become aliases when two profiles are merged. These aliases are used to match PGN name tags to the proper player. The change <Tabanus> made was to the <long name> field. CG has a number of limitations (that annoy a lot of us), one of which is that only the <long name> is what is searched by the homepage forms. So we tend to use the name most widely associated with the player. For 99% of players it will be their first and last names. However the other 1% are women who married and changed their name or players who changed their legal name for one reason or another. This becomes challenging for us at times. If CG could make use of their alias data (which exists) then a search for someone like Leo Forgacs or Leo Fleischmann would return the same results page, i.e. the bio attached to pid=10228 (the player id). |
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May-09-25
 | | jnpope: <NCA> deleted her post before I posted my response. Welll my post is still informative. |
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May-09-25
 | | NewspaperChessArchiv: <jnpope> I didn't say anything I felt was that important to contribute in any meaningful manner so that's why I deleted the comment. Too many cooks spoil the broth... inform away!
I submitted this correction, but it remains un-updated. There was never a "Howard S. Easton". Only a erroneous arrangement of his legal name. Stephen Howard Easton
September 05, 1880 - March 26, 1952
https://best-in-chess.blogspot.com/... (1942) Providence, Rhode Island;
(d.) Providence County, Rhode Island;
(b.) Cemetery Forest Chapel Cemetery, Barrington, Bristol County, Rhode Island Boston Evening Transcript, Boston, Massachusetts, Friday, April 20, 1906, p. 9
"In the evening, E. Lasker, champion of the world, gave a simultaneous exhibition on thirty boards in remarkably fast time, finishing in about four hours, or shortly after midnight. Lasker won twenty-four, drew three with H. S. Easton of Providence..." Rhode Island Championship
The annual meeting of the Rhode Island Chess Association... before the play that the winner would be the successor to the State champion, S. Howard Easton, who retired from the play, and was not a contestant. https://www.google.com/books/editio... EASTON, Stephen Howard, manufacturer, was born in Central Falls, Rhode Island, September 5, 1880, son of Nicholas Howard and Mary Ella (Jenks) Easton. His first paternal American ancestor was Nicholas Easton (q.v.), who came to this country from Wales in 1634 and was a founder of Newport, Rhode Island, in 1639. https://www.google.com/books/editio... To leave it without correction is disrespectful of his name & legacy. |
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May-09-25
 | | NewspaperChessArchiv: *mangling |
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May-09-25
 | | NewspaperChessArchiv: <jnpope> If anyone yet has doubts, here is STEPHEN HOWARD EASTON, the future Rhode Island State Champion during his days at Brown University, from the 1903 Brown University yearbook. U.S., School Yearbooks, 1900-2016 for Stephen Howard Easton
Rhode Island > Providence > Brown University > 1903 https://blogger.googleusercontent.c... |
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May-09-25
 | | NewspaperChessArchiv: Please merge profile.
Everett R Perry Everett Perry |
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May-09-25
 | | NewspaperChessArchiv: <jnpope> I deleted my comment earlier because it really contributed nothing at all of significance. However, I read your comment. I still believe a tool for disambiguation would help resolve a lot of difficulty... whether "Bobby" or "Robert" or "Tschigorin" or "Chigorin" or "Wainstein" or "Vainshtein" you are given direction to the correct profile. A related example would be a Chat GPT, that could probably tell users the name they are searching for. If you ask "who was the chess player named wainstein" -- AI replies: "The chess player named Samuil Weinstein (also known as Samuil Vainshtein or Samuil Wajnsztejn) was a prominent Russian chess master, organizer, and editor during the early 20th century." Quite nifty. |
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