| Apr-18-24 | | jffun1958: That is Stockfish output (beginning):
20...Bxc3 21.Qg2 Qh4+ 22.Bh2 Nf2+ 23.Kg1 ... |
|
| Apr-18-24 | | mk volkov: <jffun1958> I've found, 20...Bxc3 (the destruction of the defence of the Rd1) |
|
| Apr-18-24 | | mel gibson: I chose the same ply as the actual game but Stockfish doesn't like it as much. Stockfish 16 says:
20. .. Bxc3
(20. .. Bxc3 (1. ... Bxc3 2.Qg2 Qh4+ 3.Bh2 Nf2+ 4.Kg1
Nxd1 5.Qg3 Bd4+ 6.Kf1 Ne3+ 7.Ke1 Nf5+ 8.Kd2 Nxg3 9.Bxg3 Be3+ 10.Kd3 Qd4+
11.Ke2 Qd2+ 12.Kf1 Bd4 13.Bc4 dxc4 14.Be5 Qf2+) +M14/79 40) Black wins _ mate in 14.
If I force SF to follow the game ply:
20. .. Qh3+
21. Bh2 (21. Bh2 (1.Bh2 Bxc3 2.Qg2 Qxg2+ 3.Kxg2 Ne3+
4.Kg1 Nxd1 5.bxc3 Nxc3 6.a4 b6 7.Kf1 Nd1 8.Bf4 Ne3+ 9.Kf2 Nc4 10.Bh2 f6
11.Bc7 Kf7 12.Bh2 Rd8 13.Ke2 Ke6 14.Ba2 g5 15.Bg1 h5 16.Bd4 Rc8 17.Kf1 Nd6
18.Bb2 Rxc2) -6.09/43 157)
score for White -6.09 depth 43. |
|
Apr-18-24
 | | An Englishman: Good Evening: Saw both the game variation and the SF. OTB, would have played the game line. |
|
Apr-18-24
 | | scormus: Difficult to decide between 20 ... Qh3+ and ... Bxc3. After some thought I fancied ... Bxc3. Retaking looked incredibly risky for W with likely mate. I wasn't sure about the continuation after the logical defensive move, 21 Qg2, but SF says that also leads to mate. The text also wins after ... Bxc3 on the next move since the Bc3 is still poison, and it's easy to see that B wins the exchange with the N-fork after 22 Qg2 and the Q swap.
OTB I think 20 ... Qh3+ first makes sense, since getting a winning advantage doesn't depend on finding the mating sequence |
|
Apr-18-24
 | | chrisowen: I've plum q Qh3 garcon its Bxc3 acclaim mat aoh its jah its a fog pug baby its bubble its Bxc3 cub Qh3 botch; |
|
| Apr-18-24 | | Allderdice83: < jffun1958: That is Stockfish output (beginning):
20...Bxc3 21.Qg2 Qh4+ 22.Bh2 Nf2+ 23.Kg1 ...> Yep, and without looking at Stockfish, just 23 ... Nxd1 threatening 24 ... Re1+. 24. Bg3 Qd4+ 25. Kh1 Bxb2 and Black's up a rook and 3 pawns, and White has nothing. Or 25. Bf2 Re1+ 26. Kh2 Nxf2, and if 27. bxc3??, then Black has mate in two with 27 ... Qh4+. Alternatively, after 20 ... Bxc3,
21. Qxc3?? Qh2#
21. bxc3 Qxf3+ 22. Qg2 Qxd1 and Black has a rook and several pawns for the bishop. |
|
| Apr-18-24 | | TheaN: Actually saw the potential of Bxc3, wanted to play it as first move, but then realized 20....Qh3+!? would relocate the bishop first and decided to go with the second variation below, which is also completely won. Interestingly, in all possible variations the same motifs play a part, though slightly different each time, and the earlier you play Bxc3 the better. In all the variations after Bxc3, Qxc3?? leads to mate with Qh3+ and Qxh2#, and bxc3? leads to Black winning Rd1 with tempo or mating White after Qh3+ with Qxf3+ and either Qxd1+ (after Qg2) or Re2 (after Kg1). 1) <20....Bxc3!> is best, forcing <21.Qg2 (see above for alternatives) Qh4+ 22.Bh2 Nf2+ 23.Kg1 Nxd1 -+>, and Black threatens Re1+ so White can't even take on c3, Black essentially wins a rook and three pawns. 2) If instead 20....Qh3+!? first, 21.Bh2 Bxc3! which I would have played, 22.Qg2 Qxg2+ 23.Kxg2 Ne3+ 24.Kf1 Nxd1 25.bxc3 Nxc3 -+ and Black wins the exchange and three pawns, but the mating attack is gone. 3) Worst is the text: 20....Qh3+!? 21.Bh2 Qxf3+?! 22.Qg2! is again what White should have played, as after Kg1? Bf8! #10, because the rook can come to e1 after the windmill. Now the Black queen is undefended on f3, so Black has no time for Bxc3, instead required to play 22....Qxg2+ 23.Kxg2 Bxc3 24.Bg1! Bxb2 25.Rxd5 Nf6 -+ and Black is 'only' up three pawns. |
|
Apr-18-24
| | chrisowen: Hello
Na het x big h3 cup tab erm :) |
|
Apr-18-24
| | chrisowen: corp tax no? |
|
Apr-18-24
 | | pittpanther: Instead of 20. Bg1 white could have played fg, right? Then the engine says its a perpetual. |
|
Apr-18-24
 | | Check It Out: I went for 20...Bxc3. |
|
|
|
|
Kibitzing
sac: 14...Bxh3