Members · Prefs · Laboratory · Collections · Openings · Endgames · Sacrifices · History · Search Kibitzing · Kibitzer's Café · Chessforums · Tournament Index · Players · Kibitzing

George Marshall Norman vs Andre Lilienthal
Hastings (1934/35), Hastings ENG, rd 4, Dec-31
Semi-Slav Defense: Main Lines (D45)  ·  1/2-1/2


explore this opening
find similar games 603 more games of Lilienthal
PGN: download | view | print Help: general | java-troubleshooting

TIP: You can change the color of the light and dark squares by registering a free account then visiting your preferences page. Or, you can change it with the "SETTINGS" link in the lower right.

PGN Viewer:  What is this?
For help with this chess viewer, please see the Olga Chess Viewer Quickstart Guide.

Kibitzer's Corner
Sep-11-04  mjk: 66.♔d6 and 68.♔e8 were not best defense, but should still lose. White strays from the fastest win as 69...♘e5 mates in 30. Finally 76...♘d5? 77.b4! lets White escape. <-- Nalimov Tablebase Server>

Maybe Lilienthal studied after this game, but he played out a draw in Smyslov vs Lilienthal, 1940

Premium Chessgames Member
  YouRang: K+2N vs. K+P is a notoriously difficult game to win. I suspect Lilienthal knew he wasn't going to win that way, so he hoped to set up a blunder trap (diagram after 81...Kd7 - white to move):

click for larger view

Black is hoping for 82. b7??? Ne6#, but white didn't fall for it.

As <mjk> pointed out, black had a win. In fact, at move 75 he had mate-in-28 with 75...Kf6, but he played 75. Nf3? (mate-in-40), then gave up the win completely with 76...Nd5.

The winning technique in such a game is:

(1) Block the pawn with one knight.

(2) Use the other knight and king to force the opposing king into a corner. (The further advanced the pawn, the harder it is to find a corner and the right tempo that mates.) This is very difficult! The king and knight must do a very long and strange dance to work this out.

(3) At the right time (when the opposing king is sufficiently cornered), the knignt that was blocking the pawn approaches the cornered king with mating attack. This isn't quite as difficult as step 2, but it's riskier! If you time it wrong, the pawn may promote -- and then you lose!

Feb-08-09  WhiteRook48: 82. Kg7!! is one of the greatest drawing moves
Premium Chessgames Member
  FSR: <YouRang: ... If you time it wrong, the pawn may promote -- and then you lose!>

Well, maybe. King and two well-placed knights can hold the draw against a queen. Weirdly, there seem to be no examples of that ending in the database, although there are nine endings with queen versus bishop and knight (the worst set of two minor pieces with which to oppose the queen). Endgame Explorer: Q vs BN

Premium Chessgames Member
  YouRang: <Well, maybe. King and two well-placed knights can hold the draw against a queen. Weirdly, there seem to be no examples of that ending in the database>

That is rather weird that there's no games ending with Q vs 2N.

And yes, reviewing the tablebase shows that there are lots of positions where the 2N can hold the draw. However, regardless of the forced outcome, it's not an easy task for either side. For example, the position below:

click for larger view

As white, you can force mate in 43 moves -- but only if you find Qe2!

Premium Chessgames Member
  FSR: <YouRang> Queen against two knights is apparently quite rare.'s Endgame Explorer specifies that the pieces must remain on the board for three moves (six ply) for the endgame to be counted. This avoids scooping up, for example, (1) the conclusion of NN v. P endings where the pawn queens and then the other side immediately mates, or (2) the pawn queens and a knight captures it, or (3) more complicated endings where the queen sacrifices itself to produce a drawn NN ending (for example, I saw a game with Q v. RNN where the side with the queen sacrificed the queen with QxR+ to avoid the risk of loss). I found only five games in Mega Database 2013 with Q v. NN that meet the 3 moves/6 ply criterion. As I recall, there are about 5.5 million games in that database, so it's literally a one-in-a-million type phenomenon.
Sep-06-19  Chesgambit: 63. Nb4 -+ winning position
two knight versus pawn
NOTE: You need to pick a username and password to post a reply. Getting your account takes less than a minute, is totally anonymous, and 100% free—plus, it entitles you to features otherwise unavailable. Pick your username now and join the chessgames community!
If you already have an account, you should login now.
Please observe our posting guidelines:
  1. No obscene, racist, sexist, profane, raunchy, or disgusting language.
  2. No spamming, advertising, duplicate or nonsense posts.
  3. No malicious personal attacks, including cyber stalking, systematic antagonism, or gratuitous name-calling of any member Iincludinfgall Admin and Owners or any of their family, friends, associates, or business interests. If you think someone is an idiot, then provide evidence that their reasoning is invalid and/or idiotic, instead of just calling them an idiot. It's a subtle but important distinction, even in political discussions.
  4. Nothing in violation of United States law.
  5. No malicious posting of or linking to personal, private, and/or negative information (aka "doxing" or "doxxing") about any member, (including all Admin and Owners) or any of their family, friends, associates, or business interests. This includes all media: text, images, video, audio, or otherwise. Such actions will result in severe sanctions for any violators.
  6. NO TROLLING. Admin and Owners know it when they see it, and sanctions for any trolls will be significant.
  7. Any off-topic posts which distract from the primary topic of discussion are subject to removal.
  8. The use of "sock puppet" accounts to circumvent disciplinary action taken by Moderators is expressly prohibited.
  9. The use of "sock puppet" accounts in an attempt to undermine any side of a debate—or to create a false impression of consensus or support—is prohibited.
  10. All decisions with respect to deleting posts, and any subsequent discipline, are final, and occur at the sole discretion of the Moderators, Admin, and Owners.
  11. Please try to maintain a semblance of civility at all times.
Blow the Whistle See something that violates our rules? Blow the whistle and inform a Moderator.

NOTE: Keep all discussion on the topic of this page. This forum is for this specific game and nothing else. If you want to discuss chess in general, or this site, visit the Kibitzer's Café.

Messages posted by Chessgames members do not necessarily represent the views of, its employees, or sponsors. All Moderator actions taken are at the sole discretion of the Admin and Owners—who will strive to act fairly and consistently at all times.

This game is type: CLASSICAL. Please report incorrect or missing information by submitting a correction slip to help us improve the quality of our content.

Featured in the Following Game Collections[what is this?]
senakash's favorite games part 2
by senakash
NN vs P
from Endgame Studies by FENfiend
Round 4 (Monday, December 31)
from Hastings 1934/35 by Phony Benoni
A classic missed opportunity (in Fine's Basic Chess Endings)
from NN vs P: unheard melodies by David2009
Black's 62nd, White's 63rd, Black's 76th
from Annotated by Tablebase by Judah
Two Knights versus Pawn
by Resignation Trap
Tricky K+2N vs. K+P endgame - drawn when "trick" fails
from Games analyzed by YouRang by YouRang
Boriescu - bastrikova
from Voraces 2019 by Enjoy live

home | about | login | logout | F.A.Q. | your profile | preferences | Premium Membership | Kibitzer's Café | Biographer's Bistro | new kibitzing | chessforums | Tournament Index | Player Directory | Notable Games | World Chess Championships | Opening Explorer | Guess the Move | Game Collections | ChessBookie Game | Chessgames Challenge | Store | privacy notice | contact us
Copyright 2001-2019, Chessgames Services LLC