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Bird / Dobell vs Gunsberg / Locock
Consultation game (1897), Hastings ENG, Feb-??
Bird Opening: From Gambit. Lasker Variation (A02)  ·  0-1

ANALYSIS [x]

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Kibitzer's Corner
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 3 OF 5 ·  Later Kibitzing>
Dec-02-09  muralman: I didn't get an answer for my unique last puzzle move. This time I am in agreement with almost all the above. unlike yesterday, the Queen move is obvious to me, and so final. It is my opinion the powers that be got the two days got mixed up.
Dec-02-09  lost in space: After 9...Qxh2 10. Rxh2 (else: lost of the rook) 10...gxh2 the queening of the h2 pawn can not be prohibited.

Easier than yesterday.

Dec-02-09  Jason Frost: I am no expert on chess history, but I have to doubt this game's existence, or at least that it is attributed to the correct players.

Bird and Gunsberg were both two of the best players of their times. Dobell and Locock were both strong amateur players, with Locock having won the British Amateur Championship.

I can not find any possible explenation as to how these 4 players could miss the obvious mate after 6. Nd4 and how Bird and Dobell could miss the threat of 5...g4. Even if they were all completely drunk, and playing team blitz I could not envision this game occurring.

Furthurmore, Dobell was born in 1864. Bird in 1830. It seems highly unlikely that these two would pair up to play chess games, especially in 1866(2 years after Dobell was born) when CG's database has them playing Steinz.

Dec-02-09  patzer2: Correction: Today's is a Wednesday puzzle, even though it was Tuesday shortly after 11 PM Central time when I posted from my current location.
Dec-02-09
Premium Chessgames Member
  sleepyirv: Knowing an opening trap can make some of these puzzles easy.
Dec-02-09  A Karpov Fan: got it
Dec-02-09  WhenHarryMetSally: I thought about this problem. I noticed certain things.

Firstly the white queen seems restricted. I thought about trapping it via some pawn pushes i.e. 9…..Pa6 and 10….Pb5. But these are problematic if 10. Nxc6.

I then thought about attacking the H1 white rook and coronating that advanced pawn. E.g. 9…….Qxh2, but then the threat of 10. Nxc6 was ever looming and present, making that dangerous.

Then I thought about playing Bd7. This gets rid of the discovered check problem should white play Nxc6 in the future. And if that was played then Bxc6 by black could help put pressure on that g2 pawn. It also gives black room later on to castle queenside, in relative safety. It also gives black the opportunity to later on threaten white’s queen with a few pawn pushes.

Black’s kingside knight would also be very dangerous if sitting on the e4 square. Also, Rg8 would also pressure that g2 pawn

I think 9….Bd7 as well as 10….Nf6 and 11…..Pxh2 and Qf2 followed by Bg3 are in order for black.

I’ll check now. Somehow I think the right move involves trapping that white queen, and not a developmental move like Bd7.

Dec-02-09  Stormbringer: Weird week for me, missed Monday (even if I had realised the underpromotion worked because of the check I'd have flubbed the draw).

Missed Tuesday because I wanted to do Rxf3.

Got this one, but if white doesn't resign when I play around with the knight and queen in the top left corner (Nxc6 etc) it looks really bad for black?

Dec-02-09  WhenHarryMetSally: I suck.

I"m not sure why after: " E.g. 9…….Qxh2, but then the threat of 10. Nxc6 was ever looming and present, making that dangerous."

Dec-02-09
Premium Chessgames Member
  offramp: 6...Qh4+ does look pretty deadly.
Dec-02-09  whiteshark: Too early resignation, imo.
Dec-02-09  zanshin: <Easier than yesterday.>

That's what I was going to say.

Dec-02-09  gofer: I liked this one. Black can win after just 9 moves!

9 ... Qxh2

Now what can white do? Kc2, Rxh2, Nxc6, what else?

The point is that white is not only threatening to win Rh1 for a pawn, but also that Bf1 cannot be defended! So white is losing 2 pieces for Nc6 and Pg3.

1)
10 Kc2 Qxh1 (white loses a tempo for no benefit)
11 Nxc6 Bd7
12 Qe4+ Kf8
13 Ne4 Qxf1 winning

2)
10 Rxh2 gxh2
11 Nxc6 h1=Q (11 ... bxc6 12 Qxc6+ Ke7 Qxa8)
12 Ne5+ Ke7 winning as either Ne5 or Bf1 is lost
12 Nd4 Kf8 winning as Bf1 cannot be protected
12 Nxa7 Kf8 winning as Bf1 cannot be protected
12 Ke1 Bg3+ winning

3)
10 Nxc6 Qxh1
11 Ne5+ Ke7 winning as either Ne5 or Bf1 is lost
11 Nxa7 Kf8 winning as Bf1 cannot be protected
11 Nd4 Kf8 12 Ke1 Bh3 winning
11 Qe4+ Kf8 winning as either Nc6 or Bf1 is lost

Time to check...

Dec-02-09  Whitehat1963: I kept looking for some kind of attack against the king. Silly of me.
Dec-02-09  stacase: 9...Qxh2

I think I would have seen and done this over the board a lot sooner than finding it in this puzzle.

Dec-02-09  TheaN: Wednesday 2 December 2009

<9....?>

Target: 2:10;000
Taken: 3:06;825

Material: White up, ♙

Candidates: <[Qxh2]>

-ML-
One of the more beautiful tactical options in chess, saccing a more worthy piece to get either a material advantage or a pawn to promotion. In this case, however, I was worried about a Whiye response, but it seems it leads to at least an exchange up for Black.

<9....Qxh2! 10.Rxh2> not taking the Queen is an option too, but in the end it will win a Rook for Black, and now it'll cost a pawn, the pawn that promotes.

<10....gxh2 11.Nxc6> okay, suddenly, Black should be careful. At this point they are a Queen and piece for Rook down, and HAVE to secure the promotion of pawn h2. This because White is threatening 12.Qh4 :

<11....h1=Q > and the discovered checks do not really help White. After 12.Ne5† Kf8, the Bishop on f1 falls, with mate to follow. Any other Knight check (aside Nb8) allows Bd7 with crucial tempo. If Black does decide to play 10.Nxc6 Qxh1, with now 11.Ke1, 11....Qg1! should end the game (in the main variation, Ke1 is met by Bg3† ). Time to check.

Dec-02-09  Stoned Knight: Where they playing doubles? like at Wimbledon?
Dec-02-09  TheaN: 3/3

Maybe some people are missing that if White decides not to take out pawn g3, Ke1 is a valuable resource:

<10.Nxc6 Qxh1 11.Ke1?!>, as opposed to 10.Rxh2 gxh2 11.Nxc6 h1=Q 12.Ke1? Bg3† 13.Kd1 Qxf1† 14.Kc2 Qf5† 15.Kb2 Bd7 , but I think that <11....Qg1! > wins the easiest by winning another piece (11....Bd7 12.Qe4† Ne7 13.Nd4 does not). As such, there IS a difference between 10.Nxc6 and 10.Rxh2... whether pawn g3 is there or not.

Dec-02-09  agb2002: White is a pawn up. The advanced pawn on g3 suggests 9... Qxh2:

A) 10.Rxh2 gxh2 11.Nxc6 h1=Q 12.Qe4+ Ne7 13.Nxe7 (or 13.Qf3 Nxc6) Qxf1+ 14.Kc2 Bxe7 - + [R+2B vs B+N+P].

B) 10.Nxc6 Qxh1

B.1) 11.Qe4+ (11.Ne5+ Kf8 12.Ke1 Bxe5 - +) Ne7 is similar to A.

B.2) 11.Ke1 Bd7 - + [R].

Dec-02-09  gtgloner: 9. ... Qxh2 10. Rxh2 gxh2 and I don't see anything that white can do to prevent the pawn from queening. Let's see.
Dec-02-09  Fervac: 6...Nc6? i don´t see any comments about this move 6... Qh4+ and so 7.g3 Bxg3 8.hxg3 Qg3++

later in the 9... Qxh2 win easily

Dec-02-09  David2009: Wednesday's puzzle Bird / Dobell vs Gunsberg / Locock, 1897 Black 9...?

9...Qxh2 picks up a Rook and White has not enough counterplay: e.g. 10 Rxh2 gxh2 11 Nxc6 h1=Q and Black wins a further piece in the complications e.g. 12 Ne5+ Kf8 13 Qf4 Bxe5 14 Qxe5 Qxf1+ 15 Kc2 Qf6 and Black is a R ahead. Relatively best seems 10 Nxc6 Qxh1 11 Ke1 Kf8 12 Qd4 f6 13 Nb4 and Black is a solid exchange ahead. Alternative 12th moves for White seem weaker: 12 Nd4? Qg1!; 12 Nb4 Bf5 threatening 13 ...Qg1. Time to check how the game in fact finished.
========
9...Qxh2 10 Resigns ?? Now that is a surprise. Playing out my 'relatively best' line gives, with Black to play,


click for larger view

and Black is indeed a solid exchange ahead, but there is plenty of play left in the position.

Time to digest comments from other kibitzers. Time also to set up a Crafty link to see if there was a better continuation for Black after 9...Qxh2 10 Nxc6.

Dec-02-09  YetAnotherAmateur: <gofer> In your variation 2, I'm not so sure the bishop is lost as well. 10. Rxh2 gxh2
11. Nxc6 h1=Q
12. Ne5+ either Ke7 or c6
13. Qf4
A) 13. ... Qxf1
14. Qxf1 Bxe5
and white has a queen vs rook+bishop
B) 13. ... Bxe5
14. Qxe5+ Kmoves
15. Qf4
Dec-02-09  hedgeh0g: I can just imagine the discussion before the game starts between Bird and his partner, with Bird pressing him to play 1.f4. "Seriously, it's a good move!" :P
Dec-02-09  Patriot: <<SamAtoms1980>: This took me a while, but 9 ... Qxh2 scores a rook by promoting back the captured queen. (If Nxc6 Bd7!)>

What happens after Qh4? Simple is better. After 9...Qxh2 10.Nxc6, just play 10...Qxh1.

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