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Feb-25-02
 | | Sneaky: Scandinavian defense, huh? I always called it the "Center Counter." My question is: is this any good?? Is it playable? Specifically, after 1. e4 d5 2. exd5 does Black have the option of playing 2. ... Qxd5 with any success, or must he rely on gambits like 2. ... Nf6? The great appeal of this opening to me, is that if I were to become good at it, all of my 1. e4 opponents would all have to combat my Center Counter game. Talk about economy of variations... all of my 1. e4 defense knowledge would fit into one thin chapter of ECO, a chapter my opponents have probably not studied in great depth. |
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Aug-27-02
| | Sneaky: OK you 1.e4 players, tell me the scoop on the Scandinavian defense (B01)
1. e4 d5!? 2. exd5
Is it laughable? A powerful weapon? How do you approach it as White? I would think that White's best opening plan is to try to make the queen move excessively and thereby get a lead in development. Yet, I've been looking at some of these games, and it seems to me it's one of those defenses that's "not as bad as it looks." The Black Queen is not so poorly placed on a5, and in some cases Black can make an issue out of the pin on the c3 knight. On a related subject, there is also 1. e4 d5 2. exd5 Nf6, which to me seems very solid. Consider the popular line 1. e4 d5 2. exd5 Nf6 3. d4 Bg4, looking at this position, at first glance it seems like Black has slipped an extra move in! |
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| Aug-29-02 | | refutor: in my opinion it's like any of those defenses that "aren't as bad as they look"...it's playable, but there are better things to play, and i sure as heck wouldn't play it ;) |
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| Sep-01-02 | | knightmare: It's a great surprise weapon to use on all those people that memorize lots of line out of the Ruy or Sicilian, but I wouldnt suggest paying it regularly! |
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| Dec-10-02 | | drukenknight: Opening Blunders Made Easy. By DK. The Scandanavian Knight Sack again. This time it really works, I promise. Okay I've improved that stupid knight sack we played here a few months ago. This time black plays a little tougher too. 1 e4 d5 2 Nc3 d4 3 Nd5! c6 4 Nf4 e5 5 Nh5!? (the new move) g6 6 Bc4 gxh5 7 Qxh5 Qf6 8 d3 Be6!? 9 Bg5!? that's one way, not everyone plays 8...Be6 and not everyone will recapture with Q (10 Bxe6 Qxe6) some will recapture 10...fxe6. There is another threat having to do with Nf3/g5 putting more pressure on f7. sometimes you can attack the black Q in the open too. The nice thing is given an ordinary Scandanavian player you can pretty much get the first 8 or 9 moves w/o much trouble. Well that's about the extent of our knowledge, the move 5 Nh5!? is only about 48 hours old. |
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| Dec-10-02 | | AgentRgent: Sneaky, I've studied the Scandinavian some, mostly for the same reason you're interested.. it Forces people into your opening (I play the Alekhines, for the same reason). Current theory (that i've read) is that it's playable with both Qxd5 and Nf6. I suspect that at GM level equality would be harder to come by, but at club level it's acceptable. Two books that I have on it are Winning with the Scandinavian by Ron Harman and Shaun Taulbut (lots of lines, but little discussion) and Gambit Opening Repetoire for Black by Eric Schiller (deals with much more than just the Scandinavian, but has a good deal on 1. e4 d5 2. exd5 Nf6) Just my $.02 |
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| Dec-10-02 | | drukenknight: When you play this as black, do you feel that you are losing a tempo at the outset? It doesnt seem to be a problem though. ALso have you seen Lasker/Whitaker in this opening? WHere notorious felon Norman Whitaker beats Emanuel at the Mercantile club. It's not in the database, I have the game score but am too lazy to type it. |
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| Dec-24-02 | | BrownRecluse: One has to be either insane or a fool to play the Center Counter. I've played it since about 1979! I found this quote in a rapidly decaying, musty rather foul smelling volumn that I keep locked away "The Center Counter is better than its reputation, and its unpopularity is largely undeserved...Black does not hem in his bishop, and White is forced to adopt an open game in order to sustain the initiative." MCO11 p.229 Walter Korn
I now return to my pint of Guinness.
Cheers! |
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| Dec-24-02 | | PVS: An analysis of this opening was recently requested in the context of its most famous recent appearance. Kasparov vs Anand, 1995 |
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Dec-24-02
| | Sneaky: Drukenknight, you say <lose a tempo from the start> ... yes, I know exactly what you mean, you are referring to 1. e4 d5 2. exd5 Qxd5 3. Nc3 Qd8
Why anybody would play that line baffles me. Black starts the game a tempo down, how can he afford to waste time like that? However there are other critical lines that are quite interesting ... 1. e4 d5 2. exd5 Nf6
and
1. e4 d5 2. exd5 Qxd5 3. Nc3 Qd6
and
1. e4 d5 2. exd5 Qxd5 3. Nc3 Qa5 |
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| Dec-24-02 | | GregorMendel: I haven't studied the Scandinavian much, but in my inexperienced opinion I do not think much of 2...Nf6. I will play 3. c4 and defend d5 to the death, or at least make you pay dearly for it. I think when I play 3. c4 it's like Black has gambited his pawn and plays for quick development and an attack...but personally, I would play 2...Qxd5. I think that's stronger. |
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Dec-24-02
| | Sneaky: After 1. e4 d5 2. exd5 Nf6 3. c4 c6 4. Nc3 cxd5 5. d4 you've transposed into the Caro-Kann, Panov-Botvinnik attack. |
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| Dec-25-02 | | refutor: you really can't try and hold on to the pawn with 3.c4 as shown in Chandler vs Michael Adams, 1989 i play 3.d4 and after 3. ... Nxd5 then play 4.c4 and have him either waste another tempo with his knight or have it misplaced to Nb6 |
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| Dec-25-02 | | GregorMendel: What would you play if White doesn't take d5, but pushes e5 on the second move? |
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| Dec-25-02 | | refutor: i'd either play 2. ... c6 and go for a caro-kann advanced or play 2. ... c5 and go for a caro-kann advanced with an extra tempo (since you almost always play ...c5 in the advanced), but i wouldn't stoop and play something as untheoretical and tempo wasting as the scandinavian :) |
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| Dec-26-02 | | AgentRgent: This game also shows that 2...Nf6 3. c4 can be perilous to white... A Sokolov vs Speelman, 1989 |
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| Dec-26-02 | | GregorMendel: refutor, thanks for the Chandler - Adams game. I like your suggestion of d4, then c4 with tempo - I think I'll use that line, if you don't mind much. Thanks! |
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| Jan-26-03 | | David S. Brummer: Robert Byrne in an article in Chess Life a few years ago suggested 1.e4 d5 2.ed Nf6 3.Nf3! retaining several important options. White refuses to weaken d4 with c4 He may still play B-b5 or D4 and C4 at a future time when the position has a bit more definition. |
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| May-07-03 | | brazos: If 1.e4 d5 2exd5 Nf6 3.Nf3 what about
Bg5... im convinced that you can use the extra pawn against white... creating a center blockade while you work the flanks with your bishops - Anyone know any good sites with this variation.. i think it is called the Portuguese variation.... or what about 2.... Qxd5 3. Nc3 Qd6.... know any sites devoted to this line?
*sneaky* as for forcing the opponent to play your opening.. this can easily transpose into a french... so black must also know that defense as well |
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| May-19-03 | | evertoexcel: I recently ran into this opening during a game with a friend who had never deviated from 1...e5 in the ten or so games he had played vs 1 e4. The shock value was worth it for him; although i felt I had an advantage in the opening, he grabbed a pawn and exchanged his way to victory. I don't think it is sound to try this every time out, but as far as novices go, it can be uncomfortable for white. |
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| May-19-03 | | Bears092: evertoexcel - play 2. d4, and shock your opponent right back. Blackmar Gambit. |
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| May-30-03 | | Bears092: Also, concerning all this 1.e4 d5 2. exd5 Nf6 business. I play 3. d4, and after he captures, I play c4, kicking back the N/Q, and gaining a large center. |
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May-30-03
| | Sneaky: Bears, concerning <1.e4 d5 2.exd5 Nf6 3. d4 Nxd5 4. c4 Nb6> I used to look at this and think it was good for White, and I'm sure it is, but no better than the queen's pawn openings where White plays c4 and d4. The way the Black Knight obstructs the c-pawn reminds me of the Chigorin defense. Awkward for Black? Sure it is! But if you are familiar with the position and its pitfalls I bet you could do very well with it. I have since learned that 4.c4 is not the most popular move in that position, which I find rather astounding. 4.Nf3 seems to be the 'main move.' |
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| May-30-03 | | Bears092: Sneaky - I guess you're right. In a strange sort of way I'm a player that like defending (and the eventually counterattack) more than straight forward attacking. I enjoy positions where I have to fight to defend my pawn center, knowing that if it holds, I will literally crush my opponent downwards. |
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| May-31-03 | | drukenknight: Hey you guys like Scandanavian? Here are a couple of quickie draws, that are interesting: [hint: play this one real fast]
1 e4 d5 2 Nc3 dxe4 3 Nxe4 Nc6 4 b3 Bd5 5 Bd3 Qd4 6 Qf3 Qxa1 7 Bb5 Qxc1+ 8 Ke2 Bxe4 9 Qxe4 Nf6 10 Bxc6+ bxc6 11 Qxc6+ Kd8
11 Qxa8+ Kd7 12 Qd5+ 1/2-1/2 perpetual check
now keeping that in mind, play this one real fast:
1 e4 d5 2 Nc3 dxe4 3 d4 Bf5 (3...exd3 en passant; leads to development issues after Bxd3) 4 g4 Bg6 5 h4 h5 6 Bg2 f5 7 gxf5 Bxf5 8 Nxe4 Bxe4 9 Bxe4 Nc6 10 Bg7+ Kd7 11 d5 Nb4 1/2-1/2 Neither game looks like much when taken in isolation. But if you play these lines back and forth just messing with the order of moves in the early going you will see many piece patterns that are characteristic. In the first example white recaptures with the N, the other he doesnt and the tempo change, just throws everything off. There are lots of ways to improve these, but there are lots of ideas playing around here. |
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