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Jun-24-16
 | | chancho: Speaking of old time fights...
When Jack Johnson lost his title to Jess Willard, (by knockout) the bout lasted 26 rounds out of a 45 rounder. The fight was held at Havana, Cuba in very hot weather. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udw...
The boxing technique at the time Johnson fought was kind of crude. Here's Willard getting pummeled by Dempsey:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dyj...
A fighter could stand over his opponent to beat on him, as there was no neutral corner rule in effect at the time of this fight: Dempsey losing his title to Gene Tunney:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4i...
I think it was Ali (in some documentary with Cus D'Amato) who mentioned that Gene Tunney was one of those fighters who was displaying the kind of boxing technique that could be called modern: Note Tunney's use of the jab.
Also, The title fight between Dempsey and Tunney was only pacted for 10 rounds. (probably because Dempsey no longer had the stamina to go 15.) |
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| Jun-25-16 | | Big Pawn: I don't think I've seen the Willard vs Johnson fight before. That was good footage. Dempsey really hurt Willard in their meeting. It was so brutal. I've read that he had plaster wrapped around his hands and that no one ever suffered such damage at Dempsey's hands after that. Dempsey's technique was so much more modern that Willard's and the old heavyweights, and then Tunney's technique was more modern than that. It's a lot like chess. |
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| Jun-25-16 | | Big Pawn: No doubt the roughest, toughest, dirtiest, meanest, old school, street fighting man who ever boxed was Tony "Two Ton" Galento! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6LV...
He kicked Jackie Gleason's a** in a bar fight! Hear Jackie tell the story himself to Rocky Marciano https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kq9... Quite possibly the dirtiest fight of all was Lou Nova vs Tony Galento https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qgh...
<The Nova fight is reputed to be one of the dirtiest and bloodiest fights ever fought. Nova was knocked down five times. Galento kneed, butted, gouged, hit below the belt, and on at least two knockdowns, Galento "fell" with his 230 lb (104 kg) on Nova, knees first. Referee George Blake finally stopped the mayhem at 2:44 of the 14th round.> His training routine was different,
<He was reputed to train on beer, and allegedly ate 52 hot dogs on a bet before facing heavyweight Arthur DeKuh. Galento was supposedly so bloated before the fight that the waist line of his trunks had to be slit for him to fit into them. Galento claimed that he was sluggish from the effects of eating all those hot dogs, and that he could not move for three rounds. Nevertheless, Galento knocked out the 6'3" (192 cm) DeKuh with one punch, a left hook, in the fourth round.> A typical scene in the life of two ton Tony,
<Galento's fight with Max Baer ended when the referee stopped the bout in the eighth round. On the day of the Baer fight, Galento decided to first stop off at his bar. There he had a big bowl of spaghetti, with meat balls, washed down with half a case of beer. After his meal, Galento became embroiled in an argument with his brother. The dispute ended when his brother threw his beer glass in Galento's face, severely cutting his lip. Galento was forced to get the cut stitched up, hours before the fight. Baer re-opened the cut in the first round, forcing Galento to swallow blood for the remainder of the fight. After the fight, Galento blamed his inability to "hook him around the head and butt him" for the loss> |
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Jun-28-16
| | chancho: Galento pissed Dempsey off:
<The incident we look at next was not technically a fight at all but a whuppin’ put on Galento at Stillman’s Gym on 8th Avenue in New York City. The year was still 1932 and Jack Dempsey, retired and pushing forty, was Tony’s manager at the time. Tony went through managers like he went through booze. Jack had convinced Ray Arcel to take up the role of Galento’s trainer. Dempsey felt he had a diamond in the rough here, a possible heavyweight champion. Jack just had to get Tony to train properly.Dempsey strode in one day, dressed impeccably in a handmade suit and saddle shoes. His white silk shirt and tie had been imported from Paris. His French cuffs were monogrammed with the letters JHD, just so everyone would know who was standing in front of them. (The letter H stood for Harry, which was Dempsey’s real first name.) Jack loved to spend time in France. He once told a pal, “Most people think that the most beautiful women in the world are in Hollywood, but they would be wrong. The most beautiful girls in the world are in Paris and if you are young and heavyweight champion of the world, you can meet such women. And I was young and heavyweight champion of the world.” Dempsey stood with Lou Stillman as they watched Galento loaf about in the ring. Tony was grossly overweight and looked like he needed a bath.
It only took the old champ two minutes to explode in anger.
He asked for a pair of boxing gloves and quickly removed his suit coat and shirt. He bounded into the ring and said, “Now Tony, it’s you and me. I’ll show you how we used to do it.” Stillman rang the bell and Dempsey began to stalk his fighter. Jack got that old look in his eyes again. Gene Tunney would know that look from back in 1927. Dempsey was still in good shape. He easily had enough juice left for a couple of rounds. He hit Galento with his classic left hook to the face, which split Galento’s lips. The champ closed in with a short punch that crashed down and broke Tony’s nose. Blood sprayed on Jack’s tailored trousers. The New Jersey Night Stick covered up and implored Jack to take it easy. It was just sparring after all. Dempsey continued the attack. Luckily Lou Stillman rang the bell to end the round. Tony was a bloody mess. Ray Arcel chimed in, “Jack, take the guy somewhere else… He’s driving us crazy around here.” Dempsey nodded to Galento, “Now I’m through with you. You can find yourself another manager.”> |
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| Jun-28-16 | | Big Pawn: Awesome story <chancho>! Where did you find this? |
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Jun-28-16
| | chancho: http://www.boxing.com/tony_galento_... |
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| Jun-29-16 | | User not found: All great stuff and I'm going to have to get back to you about all this, I can't even see some of the links you both posted, I've no idea why! Seen you mentioning Dempsey so you <need> to watch this documentary https://youtu.be/hfA6Poi6PnE From 1910's to the 1980's. I can't give you an exact date on how old this documentary is but I remember watching it on VHS at my mates back in the 90's sometime and remember telling him never to erase it. Little did we know the internet and YouTube would be able to find anything back then, but this is a documentary that will stay on my tablet forever. When Rocky Marciano retires I genuinely still get goosebumps. When the narrator says "And he never put a foot wrong" and that music starts, tell me it doesn't give you goosebumps? Lol. I still laugh at some of those early fighters though. The orchid man!? LOL. Also love the Bear and Schmelling fights, in fact this whole documentary is the best I've ever seen. Spare 90 mins and enjoy. |
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| Jul-01-16 | | User not found: https://youtu.be/HkvBzHUBArM
A little clip of Norton talking about the Ali fight. I watched that fight the other night, I watched the documentary version so I knew Ali was fighting with a broken jaw.. But <no way> did it happen in the 2nd round. No way. Norton says it happened in the 12th and I'm inclined to agree with him. There's about 4 good punches from Norton in the 2nd round, none of them looked like they broke Ali's jaw. I'm going to watch the Foreman fight from 74 again then settle down for the football but I'm really getting into Ali's fights now. Foreman "Mohammed Ali? Norton could have beaten him on any given night. I don't think he would have ever beat Norton!" |
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| Jul-01-16 | | Big Pawn: Thanks for the Dempsey link. I'll check it out. Make sure you watch Ali vs Cleveland Williams |
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| Jul-02-16 | | diceman: <User not found: https://youtu.be/HkvBzHUBArM A little clip of Norton talking about the Ali fight. I watched that fight the other night> Great stuff.
I watched it "Wide World of Sports" live. |
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| Jul-02-16 | | User not found: I'm going to watch the Ali Williams fight later tonight after the football. It can't be better than <any> of the Frazier fights, can it?? And I saw an American talkshow from 1990 with Ali, Frazier, Foreman and Norton (I don't like Norton one bit, I don't know what it is about him but I don't like him) and Frazier was asked about Tyson.. To my disappointment he gave a lame answer. Not saying Mike Tyson was a bad fighter, quite the opposite, but saying that he's only (it was still 1990) fought lesser fighters. You can only beat what's put in front of you :) Diceman.. That WWS has a channel on YouTube dedicated to all the old fights, it's got the documentaries <with> the fight itself. The channel is called "Famekillusion" on YouTube, check it out and thank me later. Right.. Football's on 🙌🙌🙌🙌 |
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| Jul-02-16 | | Big Pawn: The Ali vs Williams fight shows Ali at his best. It's a short fight. Cleveland Williams was one of the hardest punchers ever. In an interview during his comeback career, Foreman (on the Letterman show) said that in his 60+ fights he's only come across 3 real punchers: Gerry Cooney (said his left hook was harder than Frazier's) Ron Lyle
Cleveland Williams
Williams was a big heavyweight for his time. Very muscular. He had two great brawls with Sonny Liston when Liston was near or at his peak. |
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| Jul-03-16 | | cormier: interesting ..... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zO8... |
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| Jul-05-16 | | User not found: Well I've watched the Ali Williams fight and I agree. Ali at his best, soooo fast, sooooo elegant, sooooo great. But.. Ali v Wepner https://youtu.be/2QhLxgBPj9g
I don't even know where to start!? I'll come back another time to speak about this but...... why can't the great <Mohammed Ali> KO this bum in the first 2 rounds??? Watch the first 2 rounds! Just watch them. I thought he must have been paid to take it further, lost his mind, then couldn't do the job. I'll get back to you on this one because I don't really know what else to say right now. I do love Ali though, I love that cocky amusing well earned arrogance |
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| Jul-06-16 | | truepacifism: <Big Pawn> I am new to your forum.
Would you suggest I read all 40 pages of discussion (I would prefer not to at this time) or jump right in? I am a deep thinker and enjoy discussing meaningful questions like the ones you raise at the top of the forum. |
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| Jul-06-16 | | Big Pawn: Hello <truepacifism>, nice of you to drop by. Of the 40 pages here, some are filled with debate content and others are not. You will find some interesting discussions if you sift through them, but you certainly don't have to. There were discussion on the early pages about the moral argument, lots of discussions there. I would just zip through the pages and pause when you see something interesting. We've had some recent discussion about the Kalam argument, and also about various philosophies like verificationism, logical positivism and the falsification principle. There was a discussion about the resurrection not long ago too. Sprinkled throughout are various discussions about the evidence for atheism or theism. Feel free to comment and debate all you want.
Welcome. |
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| Jul-06-16 | | truepacifism: <Big Pawn> Thanks for the welcome. |
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| Jul-06-16 | | truepacifism: The Kalmam argument sounds interesting. I checked it out on wiki and will check it out here. |
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| Jul-07-16 | | User not found: I watched yet another heavyweight doc last night and I could be mistaken, but is Cooney the black guy who had a poor Ali impression or the black guy that moved a bit like Marciano?? Footwork wise? And I've found a GREAT Tyson documentary with Harry Carpenter from 88. They go through the Jack Johnson fights, all the early fighters as Mike points out the good points and bad points. It's gold. If I thought you'd watch it I'd post it :) |
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| Jul-07-16 | | Big Pawn: <unf>, send that documentary along if you like. Sounds good. Cooney must be Gerry Cooney, a big white guy in the late 70's early 80's. He retired Ken Norton. I think he may have knocked out shavers on one round too. Cooney was a monster puncher!
The only boxer that I saw do a great Ali impersonation was Jerry Quarry! That was great! |
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| Jul-07-16 | | diceman: <User not found: https://youtu.be/K33CUXqPknM Here you go BP. >
It has no audio. |
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| Jul-07-16 | | User not found: Oh wow. That link I just posted you. No audio because of a copyright claim yet only <24 hours ago> I watched it!! Good job I've got it on my memory stick :) Once I get settled in Spain I'll start the channel. I have days worth of documentaries and footage of old fights dating back to the early 1900's. |
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| Jul-07-16 | | User not found: I posted that before I realised you'd replied. I deleted my other post because of a certain person. I know though... 24 hours ago I watched that! That is weird |
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| Jul-07-16 | | User not found: Anyways. This Joe Louis documentary is excellent. Betrayed by America BP! Lol. https://youtu.be/-y83kTl95qI |
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| Jul-08-16 | | User not found: https://youtu.be/VRjonl8kXnc
Bert Sugar getting schooled! This can't be happening, lol. This is really interesting, it's about the Tyson Douglas fight. I don't really know what to say about that fight because Tyson took some real heavy punches, he knocked Douglas out imo (14 secs he was down) but Douglas fought like Foreman and Ali combined. Great fight. 1.Ali. (Elegance personified)
2.Frazier. (I just love the man a true gentleman)
3. Tyson. (2 punches in his repertoire but wow were they powerful) 4. Foreman. (Those old guys had it good!)
5. Liston. (Tysonesque but his private life made Tyson look like a choirboy) Btw. Did you realize Liston is the only fighter in history that no one knows when he was born <or> when he died. Literally? I'm telling you BP. I'm schooling myself, I need to. |
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