Probably the best policy would be encouraging (or demanding) people to use more their private forums, not just for post youtube links but also talk about politics as we see at Rogoffs (a very strong player page ).

But no. They insist on sharing - a form of rampant egotism - saying in effect "Listen to my fave songs, or else".

"Emancipate yourselves from mental slavery ..." - Johnny Cash and Joe Strummer, after Bob Marley.

I've had plenty of dust-ups with certain cafe kibitzers (ok, one in particular), but they're there year-round. It's easy for someone like me to see why they consider it more their home than the puzzle solvers.

One has to wonder, operationally, why the puzzle solvers can't just go over to Stumpers, or even better, a dedicated forum?

It seems clear to me, that at the very least, for reference purposes, the a dedicated forum would offer many advantages, and would such an organizational structure could offer many functional improvements, in addition (like a tournament table for each year, etc.).

But some <CG> member probably aren't predisposed to any change as compromise, or whatsoever improvement might be proffered (maybe a little of "not invented here"?).

I suppose there's a sense of entitlement, perhaps justified historically, even if not pragmatically, that the regulars in the cafe should just get out of the way of the return of the annuals. After all, many of these annuals form a strong kernel of members who have belonged to <CG> from almost its inception.

OK, the clique seems dedicated to keeping the cafe as homebase. Maybe that should have been obvious, as that's the way "things are."

Of course, my sense of fairness requires me to comment that the calls for the banning of youtube links strikes me as over-reaching, especially given how much enjoyment some members have in both posting, and listening.

Maybe <CG> could offer the other camp a music forum then?

Would that keep the elite puzzle solvers happy? It puts the onus on <Harry> (and others) to make the change, and not the solvers.

Or maybe we just keep like the setup as is, and have a yearly blowup as the puzzlers descend and the habituals complain. It's always good for a kerfuffle or two as a result. Seems like that's what the crowd wants, in the last analysis.

What do I care, anyways?

But the same comment can be made about anyone's posts - "read them, or else."

We all have egos.

It seems a small fix could take care of a lot, given that Daniel already provides for an ignore feature.

<MostlyAverageJoe> doesn't post on this site 11.5 months out of 12. I'm increasingly becoming the same. We have no interest in taking over the Café, and wouldn't do it even if the people who frequent it year-round were kicked out. I don't see it as a problem if klu-solvers need to share the Café with non-klu-solvers in December. The Café is big enough for more than one kind of poster.

What I do see as a problem is if the Café is the kind of place that turns newcomers off and discourages them from visiting Chessgames. YouTube spam can have that effect, but it also goes for the fighting, foul language, personal attacks and plain idiocy that the Café is often full of. That has nothing to do with the klu hunt, it's a year-round problem.

You said that "many of these annuals form a strong kernel of members who have belonged to <CG> from almost its inception." Yeah, it's been pretty much the same group of users every year for a long time. Not many newcomers in that group. Newcomers who might like solving klus don't stick around long enough.

Step #1: Make a new forum which represents what the Café used to represent: introductions from new members, polite discussion of recent chess-related events, etc. We enforce some degree of topicality—youtube links etc. are discouraged unless they are chess-related. For lack of creative juices let's just call it the "Chess Chatroom".

Step #2: Remove the links to the Kibitzer's Cafe on the footer etc. and make it link to the new Chess Chatroom instead.

Step #3: Rename the Kibitzer's Cafe to "Musical Fight Club". Or something.

Step #4: Rename the "Chess Chatroom" to the Kibitzer's Café and update the links.

<chessgames.com: How about this: Step #1...#4>

Step #4: Rename the "Chess Chatroom" to the Kibitzer's Café and update the links.>

Sounds good to me, but I am certain that I am overlooking some unintended consequence (mainly because I am too lazy to put thought into what those might be).

As for the one eyed fool who is a genius in his own mind saying it's a game of ego, people trying to force feed their musical tastes on the masses.. Well when word smith Dom fires off one of his "witty play on words".. Oh he thinks he's absolutely brilliant.. The bastard is the biggest egomaniac on this site.. When Dom flatulates he's very proud of it! Stupid fool!

Then you have Keyser Sose, making the comment, "90% of the YouTube links are made by same two kibitzers". I dont mind at all. Maybe put them on ignore temporarily for the Clues would solve the problem". Yo Keyser, you forgot you also post music links Bozo!

Here's a post for all the intellectual constipated old ducks on this cretin site...

A clique of mostly cranky old grandpa's who are on The Kibitzer Cafe part of the month of December seek to stamp out music from the Cafe... >

I agree with you Travis.

<It's a different kind of Fahrenheit 451!>

Yes, in elitist snob circles it's:

Sure I do some music there but I don't post 15 links in a row like some.>

Maybe you're in need of a

Anyone who tries to insult people with names like 'conehead' and 'pointy-headed' should avoid wearing a Mohican. Or is it a Mohawk?>

It is a Mohawk.

Celsius 232.78>

Can you convert that to Kelvins?>

<thegoodanarchist: 505.98

I couldn't wait any longer>

Nonsense.

I have never understood the concept of posting these trillions of links. I know how to search for music at YouTube so why should I care what other people think?