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Kermur Sire De Legal vs Saint Brie
Paris 1750  ·  Philidor Defense: General (C41)  ·  1-0
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Kibitzer's Corner
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 4 OF 4 ·  Later Kibitzing>
Apr-01-09
Premium Chessgames Member
  eternaloptimist: Legal's mate...LOL
Jul-24-09  just a kid: Ah the famous,Legal's mate.(infamous from the Black side.=)
Sep-11-09  Kasparkov: I've played many games like this, esp. on blitz game..

:)

Sep-29-09
Premium Chessgames Member
  LIFE Master AJ: My pun for this game is a line from one of the Star Wars movies.
Dec-30-09  Whitehat1963: Black's defense had more holes in it than a block of Swiss cheese!
Mar-31-10  SirChrislov: Black's defense has more holes in it than that squarepants sponge fellow!
Mar-31-10
Premium Chessgames Member
  alexmagnus: I've actually been on both sides of Legal's mate in my life. What's even funnier, the first and only time I lost to it occured <later> than the fist time I won by it.
Jun-29-10  eightbyeight: Black's defense had more holes in it than a firing range target!
Sep-02-10  Lil Swine: the classic mating trap
Mar-12-11  Amarande: Nor are the closed openings or castling entirely protective against this, either. Here White comes to grief by relying too much on the Bg5/Nf6 pin in a situation where one mightn't even think of Legal -

1 Nf3 f5 2 d4 Nf6 3 c4 e6 4 Bg5 Be7 5 Nc3 O-O 6 e3 b6 7 Bd3 Bb7 8 O-O Nc6 9 Qc2 Nb4 10 Qd2 Nxd3 11 Qxd3 a6 12 Ne5 Bd6 13 g4? fxg4 14 Nxg4??


click for larger view

14 ... Nxg4!! 15 Bxd8 Bxh2#

Mar-14-11  stst: strike this accidentally - quite a record.
anything shorter? - must be quite insane too !!
May-11-11
Premium Chessgames Member
  Nightsurfer: The move order is a fake. The real game has been executed as follows: 1.e4 e5 2.Bc4 d6 3.Nf3 Nc6 4.Nc3 Bg4 5.Nxe5!! Bxd1??? 6.Bxf7+ Ke7 7.Nd5# Please compare:!!!!! http://chessbase.de/nachrichten.asp... !!!!! Move no. 4 (4. ... g6) has been fiction: www.chesscorner.com/games/fascinating/int4.htm And the name of White player has been different, his real name has been LEGALL DE KERMEUR, please compare http://heritageechecsfra.free.fr/le...
May-11-11
Premium Chessgames Member
  Nightsurfer: Even the date of the game - "1750" - is not correct: The game has been played at Paris in 1787, please compare http://chessbase.de/nachrichten.asp...
May-12-11  APatzer: A good illustrative game for beginners.
Aug-09-11  50movesaheadofyou: <Nightsurfer> The move order has been debated for centuries. In my book, first 3...g6 and then 4...Bg4.
Oct-27-11  JoergWalter: <Nightsurfer>

see this post from 2005. The findings of Herr Maa are a little late for a new discovery. another fake?

<Jan-24-05
alexmagnus: By the way, the game here is wrong. In the real in Legal-Brie game Legal blundered an Brie didnt see it, so the game was re-moved so like shown here. The real game was very bad:1.e4 e5 2.Bc4 d6 3.Nf3 Nc6 (this move is not listed in the later editions of the game, because it destroys the biggest masterpiece of the 18th century) 4.Nc3 Bg4 5.Nxe5?? Bxd1? (after 5...Nxe5 Legals name would be forgotten) 6.Bxf7+ Ke7 7. Nd5#.>

5. Nxe5!! where did you get this from? Has to be 5. Nxe5??

Dec-10-11  dumbgai: A common line I face in blitz is 1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 d6 3. Bc4 Bg4 4. Nc3 Nc6, setting the trap 5. Nxe5 Nxe5. Of course, the correct way to play is 5. h3 Bxf3 (5...Bh5 6. Nxe5 works now) 6. Qxf3. Of course White, with the superior piece development, is doing well here, but I'm always a tad disappointed to not get 5...Bh5.
Feb-28-12  Llawdogg: Wow! I've seen this a bunch of time in tactics books. It's good to see the original.
Apr-04-12
Premium Chessgames Member
  MarkThornton:


click for larger view

Position after Black's 6th move. How did the game go?

Mark Thornton, British Chess Magazine, April 2012.

Aug-03-12
Premium Chessgames Member
  The Last Straw:


click for larger view

Jul-13-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  MarkThornton: Here's the solution to my puzzle:

1.d3 Nf6 2.Bg5 Ne4 3.Bxe7 Nc6 4.Bxd8 Bc5 5.e3 Bxe3 6.g3 Bxf2+

Sep-07-13  Amarande: I wonder if part of the reason the game score was changed in so many publications is instructional value?

Someone at some point probably realised that the game as is being claimed to actually be, is simply a blunder responded to by a greater blunder, but by making the move 4 ... g6, it becomes a very good textbook example about the tactical consequences of failure to develop efficiently: almost any non-developing 4th move falls into the trap, while virtually any productive move (Nc6, Nf6, Be7, even something as blah as Qc8 will do) nips it in the bud. Even if 4 ... Nc6 should be the correct historical move, it tends to weaken the instructional value of the game as the novice will be confused as to why Black didn't just play 5 ... Nxe5 and wins :)

Also by having the move order Bg4 then g6, the novice is taught directly that it's the wasted tempo that leads to the grief, since the Bishop move is not itself unsound (with a suitable followup, such as 4 ... Nc6 perhaps!, it fights for control of d4, a point important enough to cause White to even sometimes give up a tempo to forestall the pin, such as in the main-line Closed Spanish).

Dec-27-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  FSR: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L%C3%...
Dec-27-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  offramp: <LIFE Master AJ: My pun for this game is a line from one of the Star Wars movies.>

"I will make it, Legal"?

Dec-27-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  john barleycorn: I think it was Blackburne who said he caught a hundred of players in simuls with it. Here is an example

Blackburne vs NN, 1885

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