|Jan-02-05|| ||samvega: two amusing knight offers. echoes of the famous Reti-Tartakower miniature. |
|May-30-05|| ||TheAlchemist: This was actually voted the best game of the 1937 Olympiad if I'm not mistaken.|
|Aug-08-05|| ||Medical Director: A "Beauty". No doubt! What's the winning line for 14.B6?
|Aug-08-05|| ||beatgiant: <Medical Director: A "Beauty". No doubt! What's the winning line for 14.B6? Thanks?>|
Maybe it is 14...b6 15. Nxc6 bxa5 16. Nxb8, threatening 17. Nc7#.
|Dec-31-05|| ||Timothy Glenn Forney: "Don't look a gift horse in the mouth" "Well if you don't like my first horse,take look at my second one":)|
|Jul-02-06|| ||ganstaman: After black's 10th move, he is preparing Nf8-(g/e)6-f4 with some hopes of a kingside attack. However, he never gets the time to pull this off once white opens up the center and attacks black's exposed king. My guess then is that after 7.b3, black should give up on the already speculative kingside attack and just get the king to safety (maybe 9...0-0). Anyone else have thoughts as to how black can get a playable game?|
I'd like to add that this isn't an isolated incident. E Paoli vs A Kinzel, 1952 (although black wins this game, I don't at all like all the pressure black's king experienced).
And, from a pgn I got from a website on this opening:
[White "Hoogendoorn, P.A."]
[Black "Jansen, L.B."]
1. e4 d6 2. d4 Nf6 3. Nc3 Nbd7 4. Nf3 e5 5. Be2 Be7 6. O-O h6 7. b3 g5
8. Bb2 c6 9. Qd2 Qc7 10. Rad1 Nf8 11. dxe5 dxe5 12. Nxe5 Be6 13. Nb5 Qb8 14. Qa5 b6 15. Nxc6 Qb7 16. Nxe7 Qxe7 17. Qc3 1-0
|Jan-26-09|| ||An Englishman: Good Evening: <gangstaman>, this is how Black played the Philidor back then; don't castle early, play ...h6 and ...g5, then swing the Knight over to g6 and continue pushing the King side pawns. Horowitz wrote in 1953 that "the execution of Black's plan, unmolested, leaves him, strangely enough, with the upper hand."|
Obviously, White figured out how to molest Black.
However, b2 and e2 are inferior squares for the White Bishops and only work against this particular line. There's so little pressure on Black's position (no Bc4 menacing the f7 square, for example) that 6...0-0 will suffice for equality.
|Jan-26-09|| ||GrahamClayton: What is the winning line for White after 12...♕e5.|
|Jan-26-09|| ||jokerman: This is for everyone wondering what would happen on the two knights sacs.|
The first one: 12) Nxe5 the obvious question, why doesn't black take the knight?
After Qxe5 white can play 13) Nd5 The queen can't take the bishop on b2 beceause
white has mate in one move 14) Nc7++
So this means that Black should keep an eye on the c7 square, so play would continue with
13... Qb8 Now white has several options, but i believe the obvious move would be:
14) Nxf6+ Bxf6
15) Bxf6 white now has the piece back and a treath of mate with Qd8++ and an attack on the rook
so anyhow the game would be over
The second knight sac: 13) Nb5 if accepted with cxb5
White can play 14) Bxb5 (obvious move) the king cant go anywhere so here's an example line
Bd7 15) Bxd7+ Nxd7 16) Nxd7 Qxd7 17) Qxd7 Nxd7 and the bishop on b2 now
takes the rook with 18) Bxh1
I did not check the lines with a computer so... there are ofcourse other moves but, these ones will
get you to grasp the idea.
|Jan-26-09|| ||jokerman: I found a mistake in my previous analysis:
about the 13th move:
i didn't consider 0-0-0 for black, so here is a better one: 13) Nb5 cxb5
14) Bxb5+ N8d7 15) Nxd7! is the move
0-0-0 by black and now: 16) Be5 Qxe5 17) Nxe5 Rxd8 18) Rxd2 with a winning position for white.
the game ending was: 16) Nc7+ if black doesn't take with the queen, he has to move the king.
Ke7 17) Ba3+ the king has no squares to go, so the queen has to interpose, and white takes the queen with the bishop. With an easy winning position for white.
|Jan-26-09|| ||Dr. J: <jokerman: after 13 Nb5 <cxb5> 14 Bxb5+ N8d7 15 Nxd7 0-0-0 (!) 16 Be5 Qxe5(?) ... winning for White>. But here 16 ... Rxd7 is OK for Black. So the best I can see for White is 16 Nxf6 Rxd2 17 Rxd2 with RBPP and (I think) positional advantage for the Q.|
|Jan-26-09|| ||UnsoundHero: After 13...cxb5 14 Bxb5+ N8d7 15 Nxd7 0-0-0 16 Qc3! Bxd7 17 Bxd7+ Rxd7 18 Rxd7 Qxc3 19 Bxc3 Kxd7 20 e5! regaining the piece, for if then 20...Nd5 21 e6+ fxe6 22 Bxh8. Or 20...Rc8 21 Rd1+ Ke6 22 exf6 Rxc3 23 fxe7 Kxe7 24 Rd2 with good chances to win with the extra pawn.|
|Jan-26-09|| ||whiteshark: There must be a better 10th move for black, <10...Rg8> maybe?
click for larger view
|Jan-26-09|| ||cornholio denali: Trojan horse....whoa....|
|Jan-26-09|| ||Atking: <GrahamClayton: What is the winning line for White after 12..QxNe5.> 12...Qxe5? 13.Nd5! 13...QxBb2 14.Nc7# else 13...Qd6 14.NxNf6+ is either catastrophic. See Nimzowitsch vs Marco (Goteborg 1920) which looks at the origin of the tactical ideas behind this one. As it was noted up with Be2 and especially Bb2 h6, g5 is bit suicidal and ...0-0 is better.|
|Jan-26-09|| ||kevin86: After 17...♔e7 18 ♗a3+ is "bruinous"-more than black can bear-lol.|
|Jan-26-09|| ||mworld: that first knight offer was pure genius.|
|Jan-26-09|| ||tivrfoa: wow. I'll try do that!
agree with you mworld!
how can I quote someone message here?
12... Qxe5 13 Nb5! and I don't see good option for black. To avoid mate only sacrificing his queen.
|Jan-26-09|| ||WhiteRook48: Wow, there's a Lion Variation in the opening?|
|Jan-26-09|| ||keypusher: <Dr. J: <jokerman: after 13 Nb5 <cxb5> 14 Bxb5+ N8d7 15 Nxd7 0-0-0 (!) 16 Be5 Qxe5(?) ... winning for White>. But here 16 ... Rxd7 is OK for Black. >|
I would think so too, but Shredder points out that 17, Bxd7+ is crushing, e.g. 17....Qxd7 18. Qa5 b6 19. Qa6+ Qb7 20. Qc4+ Bc5 21. Bxf6, or 18....Qc6 19. Qxa7. So Shredder thinks 16. Be5 is best after all. But there is more than one way to win here.
|Jan-26-09|| ||keypusher: <whiteshark: There must be a better 10th move for black, <10...Rg8> maybe?>|
That is Dr. Tartakower's own recommendation, on his 9th or 10th move.
|Jan-27-09|| ||Dr. J: <keypusher>: <jokerman: 13 Nb5 cxb5 14 Bxb5+ N8d7 15 Nxd7 0-0-0 16 Be5 Qxe5 <then> Dr.J: ... Rxd7 <then> keypusher/Shredder: 17, Bxd7+ Qxd7 18. Qa5 b6 19. Qa6+ Qb7 20. <Qc4+ Bc5 21. Bxf6> is crushing>> But 20 Qc4+ Bxc4. Perhaps you had a mistaken start position?|
|Jan-27-09|| ||keypusher: <Dr. J: <keypusher>: <jokerman: 13 Nb5 cxb5 14 Bxb5+ N8d7 15 Nxd7 0-0-0 16 Be5 Qxe5 <then> Dr.J: ... Rxd7 <then> keypusher/Shredder: 17, Bxd7+ Qxd7 18. Qa5 b6 19. Qa6+ Qb7 20. <Qc4+ Bc5 21. Bxf6> is crushing>> But 20 Qc4+ Bxc4. Perhaps you had a mistaken start position?>|
Yes, I must have played ...Bd7 instead of ...N8d7 on Black's 14th move. I am sorry.
On the other hand it doesn't seem to matter to Shredder: 15 Nxd7 0-0-0 16 Be5 Rxd7 17. Bxd7+ Qxd7 18. Qa5 and Black is helpless. 18....Qc6 is answered by Qxa7 as before and other queen moves off the d-file allow Qc7#. 18....b6 loses to 19. Qc3+. 18....Bd5 19. Qxa7 followed by exd5 isn't much better.
|Jan-28-09|| ||Dr. J: <keypusher: <Dr. J: <keypusher>: <jokerman: ... <then> Dr.J: ... <then> keypusher/Shredder: ... > ... <Dr. J.> But ...> On the other hand ... > |
Yes, that does seem to be the last word on the subject.