chessgames.com
Members · Prefs · Laboratory · Collections · Openings · Endgames · Sacrifices · History · Search Kibitzing · Kibitzer's Café · Chessforums · Tournament Index · Players · Kibitzing

(If you register a free account you won't see all these ads!)
Vladimir Kramnik vs Shakhriyar Mamedyarov
Tal Memorial (2007), Moscow, rd 8, Nov-18
Modern Defense: Averbakh Variation (A42)  ·  1-0
ANALYSIS [x]

FEN COPIED

NOTE: You are using our new chess viewer, "Olga." For more info see the Olga Quickstart Guide. You can switch back to the old viewer (pgn4web) from the pulldown menu below. If you have questions or suggestions see our Olga chessforum.

explore this opening
find similar games 33 more Kramnik/Mamedyarov games
PGN: download | view | print Help: general | java-troubleshooting

TIP: You can get computer analysis by clicking the "ENGINE" button below the game.

PGN Viewer:  What is this?
For help with this chess viewer, please see the Olga Chess Viewer Quickstart Guide.
PREMIUM MEMBERS CAN REQUEST COMPUTER ANALYSIS [more info]

Kibitzer's Corner
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 23 OF 23 ·  Later Kibitzing>
Nov-18-07
Premium Chessgames Member
  whiteshark: <acirce> Pure coincidence again ? :D
Nov-18-07  KamikazeAttack: <Inf: i could be one moron. And i am very proud to be. >

Say no more.

Nov-18-07  KamikazeAttack: When Kramnik plays black, he usually reaches full equality with amazing ease by about move 25, 90% of the time.

Question is, why do his opponents accept his offer of a draw rather than stubbornly play on ... like Mame supposedly did in this game? I will tell u why.

Because of his accurate play style & endgame prowess, many donít wanna be drawn into the deep waters from an equal position. U notice his competitors are not complaining about his draws as black because they are the ones accepting his offers. They donít have to accept, u know:)

In Elista, Topalov was worse off in many played out games as White in the drawn end games.

Not accepting to split the point would give Kramnik many wins as black.

Nov-19-07  dabearsrock1010: is the endgame after 39... Qg7 lost for black?
Nov-19-07
Premium Chessgames Member
  notyetagm: <KamikazeAttack: ... Not accepting to split the point would give Kramnik many wins as black.>

Why would Kramnik then offer draws if he could outplay his opponents from equal positions as Black? That seems like laziness.

Nov-19-07
Premium Chessgames Member
  notyetagm: <thedarkisrising: <notyetagm:I am just amazed at how well Kramnik is playing chess in this tournament.> Does this mean the end of your days as a Kramnik-basher?>

Problems with Kramnik:

1) Has never won a qualifier for a World Championship match

2) Ducked a rematch with Kasparov, who dominated tournament chess from '99 to '02

3) Has gone back on his word that Mexico City was for "THE" World Championship

Nov-19-07  suenteus po 147: <acirce> I said what?!
Nov-19-07  chessmoron: <Has never won a qualifier for a World Championship match> Anand and Kamsky are the only one who has completely the Interzonal-Candidate Match-WC Match format.

Saying Kramnik never won a qualifier for a WC match is wrong because he qualified twice for the 2nd stage of World Championship match qualification.

<Ducked a rematch with Kasparov> So you are saying it's not right to use you contract advantages.

Nov-19-07  KamikazeAttack: <notyetagm: <KamikazeAttack: ... Not accepting to split the point would give Kramnik many wins as black.> Why would Kramnik then offer draws if he could outplay his opponents from equal positions as Black? That seems like laziness. >

I think it is called being judicious.

Nov-19-07
Premium Chessgames Member
  ahmadov: The players' current rating is not correct on the score sheet here... I think <CG> should correct them...
Nov-19-07  arnaud1959: I already wrote that I don't like Kramnik so much but he is definitely very impressive. This game is incredible. Even in a fully tactical position he finds strategical ideas (a slightly safer king, opponents bishop almost passive...), a game worthy of Botvinnik. Anand has to find something new against him: 1.d4? or Bishop's opening?? or a revolution in Petroff maybe.

One word for Shak: He lost this game but he showed that he could be a very dangerous challanger in the future. He reminds me of Kasparov who first couldn't beat Karpov but finally got more experience and made Karpov collapse even emotionally.

Nov-19-07
Premium Chessgames Member
  acirce: <suenteus po 147> Heh. Robert Fontaine said that in one of his videos for Europe-Echecs.
Nov-19-07  suenteus po 147: <acirce> Curse my higher-rated and supremely more talented doppleganger! I guess I will have to learn to live in his shadow :)
Nov-19-07  Topista: Congrats to all Kramnikites.
That includes me.Though it might sound strange.
I can't figure out how can he be defeated in a match .
Nov-19-07  Inf: <Softpaw><He simply CHOOSES these days to play more conservatively, as part of a well-honed super-GM level strategy. That's the way he expresses HIS fighting-spirit.>Ok. before you go and make another dumb post, please go ahead and search what "fight", "fighting" means. If to you <fight> means <conservative play> i will not waste my time with you.

<KamikazeAttack><Question is, why do his opponents accept his offer of a draw rather than stubbornly play on ... >The question or point was why Kramnik plays for a draw or "not to lose as black" or "conservative" or "equality" as black. I know he is superb at endgames, his accurate play, but thats not the question.

<If> Kramnik would play as black the way he plays as white (ALWAYS pushing or trying to win, having the initiative), he will be a really complete champion. Please dont get me wrong, im not bashing him, his games as white are really impressive, oustanding to watch, and worth of study, but as black you can learn how to be a wall against white.

Ask yourself one question: when you play a game of tennis, ping-pong, chess or whatever, do you play not to lose? or do you play to reach equality? or do you play to win?

Nov-19-07  KamikazeAttack: <Ask yourself one question: when you play a game of tennis, ping-pong, chess or whatever, do you play not to lose? or do you play to reach equality? or do you play to win? >

U play to win just like Kramnik.

This is exactly why Kramnik has won in:

Turin Olympiad - Gold Medal (TPR 2847 - overall best perfomance) 2006

Dormund 2006

WCC Match, Elista 2006

Amber 2007

Dortmund 2007

Tal 2007

Nov-23-07  Discerning King: On 30. would somebody explain to me, why is Rxb2 not played by Kramnik?...does that white Knight hold the pawns on c and mostly d pawn as a Blockader?
Nov-23-07
Premium Chessgames Member
  luzhin: After 30.Rxb2 Rxb2 31.Nxb2 Qb1+ followed by Qxb2. Yes,the White knight is the best minor piece in such positions and should not be exchanged for the Black bishop --as the later course of the game demonstrates.
Sep-03-08
Premium Chessgames Member
  GrahamClayton: <dabearsrock1010>is the endgame after 39... Qg7 lost for black?

After 40.♕c7 White wins the c-pawn. As Black's main counterplay was c5/c4, I think this is a winning advantage.

Sep-03-08
Premium Chessgames Member
  GrahamClayton: Oops! I meant 40.♕c8 and White wins the c-pawn.

Oct-17-08  ppeti84: It's more like a game by Mihail Tal on the Kramnik-memorial...
Mar-28-10  sezori: Wonder why Mamedyarov played 28. Rb6??, he practically loses the bishop for free after... 29. Rxb2!. Can't take due to 29...Rxb2 30. Qxd4!! picking up the rook and bishop.

If 30...Qe5?? Then 31. Nd7 forking king and queen probably with immediate resignation...Guess that "fresh eyes" theory was correct, probably wouldn't find this if I were in the tension of the game. However, depending on the time control I probably WOULD have found this simple 3-4 move idea...

Someone correct my human calculation with a brutal computer analysis as to why Rxb2 wouldn't work... ^_^ I don't mind criticism...

Mar-28-10
Premium Chessgames Member
  tamar: <sezori> I thought I had the answer when I found 29 Rxb2 Qe1+ 30 Kh2 Rxb2 31 Qxd4+ Qe5+ 32 Qxe5 Kxe5 but then comes 33 Nd3+


click for larger view

and even after 33...Kd4 34 Nxb2 c5 35 f4 White looks winning.

Perhaps someone with access to a computer could check this, as it is hard to believe Kramnik would overlook this.

Jul-31-12  Nerwal: On 28... ♖b6 29. ♖xb2, simply 29... ♖xb2 30. ♕xd4+ ♔f7 = (31. ♕xb2 ♕xc5). Apart from this line, 29... ♕e1+ 30. ♔h2 ♕e5+ 31. g3 ♕h5+ 32. ♔g2 ♖xb2 33. ♕xd4+ ♔f7 34. ♘e4 looks quite dangerous for black despite being the exchange up.
Mar-18-15  Conrad93: Isn't 24. Qxd6 cxd6 25. Ne6+ Kf6 26. Nxd4 a losing variation?
Jump to page #    (enter # from 1 to 23)
search thread:   
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 23 OF 23 ·  Later Kibitzing>
NOTE: You need to pick a username and password to post a reply. Getting your account takes less than a minute, totally anonymous, and 100% free--plus, it entitles you to features otherwise unavailable. Pick your username now and join the chessgames community!
If you already have an account, you should login now.
Please observe our posting guidelines:
  1. No obscene, racist, sexist, or profane language.
  2. No spamming, advertising, or duplicating posts.
  3. No personal attacks against other members.
  4. Nothing in violation of United States law.
  5. No posting personal information of members.
Blow the Whistle See something that violates our rules? Blow the whistle and inform an administrator.


NOTE: Keep all discussion on the topic of this page. This forum is for this specific game and nothing else. If you want to discuss chess in general, or this site, you might try the Kibitzer's Café.
Messages posted by Chessgames members do not necessarily represent the views of Chessgames.com, its employees, or sponsors.
Spot an error? Please submit a correction slip and help us eliminate database mistakes!
This game is type: CLASSICAL (Disagree? Please submit a correction slip.)

Featured in the Following Game Collections [what is this?]
Chess strategy
by obrit
Harrassing a King to death
from Kramnik on a King Hunt & vs the World Champions by visayanbraindoctor
Book of Samurai's favorite games 6
by Book of Samurai
268
from Kramnik - My Life and Games by JoseTigranTalFischer
Kramnik plays a beautiful tactical game!
from Interesting Games to Study by qskakaley
barb's favorite games
by barb
QN wins
from 48c_Q+B : Q+N by whiteshark
martinsaw's favorite games
by martinsaw
Kramnik combines threats to Black king, passed a-pawn to win
from THE POWERFUL PASSED PAWNS by notyetagm
268
from Kramnik - My Life and Games by jakaiden


home | about | login | logout | F.A.Q. | your profile | preferences | Premium Membership | Kibitzer's Café | Biographer's Bistro | new kibitzing | chessforums | Tournament Index | Player Directory | Notable Games | World Chess Championships | Opening Explorer | Guess the Move | Game Collections | ChessBookie Game | Chessgames Challenge | Store | privacy notice | contact us
Copyright 2001-2017, Chessgames Services LLC