Eggman: <<Oops, forgot about that.>>

That's why this game is called 'Battles of the *Brains*'. It's bad enough that all our decisions for the next 20 moves are probably going to be based on theory, but for crying-out-loud let's make sure everyone understands:

NO COMPUTERS!!!!

Not to rake you over the coals, <Hesam7>.

crawfb5:

click for larger view

Just for laughs, I checked my database and I have 85 games with this line! The statistics are heavily skewed toward Black, so unless someone comes up with a novelty, I don't think I'll be voting for this path.

Here's an ICCF game as an example:

[Event "Wch24 sf05"]
[Site "corr ICCF"]
[Date "2000.??.??"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Bensiek, Norbert (GER)"]
[Black "Kroll, Ove"]
[Result "0-1"]
[WhiteElo "2414"]
[BlackElo "2480"]
[ECO "B44"]

1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 e6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nc6 5.Nb5 d6 6.Bf4 e5 7.Bg5 Qxg5 8.Nc7+ Kd8 9.Nxa8 Bg4 10.f3 Qe3+ 11.Be2 Be6 12.Nc3 Nf6 13.Qd2 Qxd2+ 14.Kxd2 Kc8 15.Nb5 Ne8 16.Nxa7+ Nxa7 17.Nb6+ Kb8 18.Nd5 Nc7 19.Ne3 g6 20.c4 Nc6 21.Rad1 Nd4 22.h4 h5 23.g4 Be7 24.g5 f6 25.gxf6 Bxf6 26.Rdg1 Bf7 27.b3 Bg7 28.Bd1 Bh6 29.a4 Nce6 30.Re1 Nf4 31.Rh2 Rc8 32.Kc3 Bg7 33.Rg1 Bf6 34.Kb2 Ka7 35.Rg3 Kb6 36.Rg1 Ka5 37.Rg3 Kb4 38.Nc2+ Nxc2 39.Bxc2 Bd8 40.Ka2 Bb6 0-1

jepflast: <Boomie: It seems to me that the question of 4...e5 is whether 5. c4 is an advantage for white. Since we can stop c4 by playing 4...Nf6, we should consider if c4 is a strength or a weakness. Our knight goes to f6 in most lines so this is a question of timing.>

This is a good thought. My instinct was that c4 is a waste, but now I think that's wrong after looking through the OE. I like the positions where they omit c4 better (for Black). It's probably because the Na3 is going to c4 and there is vulnerable to our ..b5. Better for the N to go thru c2.

If we are playing 4...e5, your line:
1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. d4 cxd4 4. Nxd4 e5 5. Nb5 d6 6. c4 Be7 7. N1c3 a6 8. Na3 Be6, seems like the most sensible thing now that I look in detail. Maybe not the most exciting, but Black is doing fine. However, to your point, I'm not sure of a reason not to begin with <4...Nf6> instead. We can still play ..e5 later, or go for a different structure.

Sneaky: I think we will see 4...e5 (why else bring the queen's knight out first?) and then surely 5.Nb5 (other moves are inferior) and then they can play either 5...d6 (Sveshnikov) or 5...a6 (Lowenthal).

On the subject of 5...a6 I am the resident expert and I promise you we can win that game by force--the Lowenthal is busted and I have the notes to prove it. Black ends up with a horrible endgame in spite of having a temporary lead in development.

But I really doubt they'll go there. This is heading into Sveshnikov territory.

cro777: A comparison between Kalashnikov (4...e5) and Sveshnikov (4...Nf6 5.Nc3 e5) might be interesting. The Kalashnikov ("Improved Sveshnikov") often transposes into the Sveshnikov (Pelikan).

1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 <e5> 5.Nb5 d6 6.N1c3 <This is White's first choice> a6 7.Na3

click for larger view

<7... Be6> is best Black's way to remain in the Kalashnikov system.

<7...b5> 8.Nd5 Nf6 9.Bg5 leads to the Sveshnikov (Pelikan).

1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 <e5> 6.Ndb5 d6 7.Bg5 a6 8.Na3 <Sveshnikov>

click for larger view

The dynamic move <...e5> creates an unbalanced position. Black accepts a backward pawn d6 and gives White control of d5. In return, Black pushes White's knight to a3 (White has lost several tempi by playing Nf3-Nxd4-Nb5-Na3) and can contest the d5 point. GM Evgeny Sveshnikov always evaluates any variation in this system by first considering the fight for the d5-square.

The main difference between Sveshnikov and Kalashnikov, given by the moves 4...Nf6 5.Nc3, is that in Kalashnikov Black avoids the pin on the f6-knight.

capafan: A good OTB example of 4...e5 play...

Ivanchuk vs Radjabov, 2004

An older, very detailed look at these lines by <Life Master AJ>.

http://www.ajschess.com/thegotmman/...

capafan: A slow maneuvering game between chess engines...maybe we can improve on it?

Spark vs Shredder, 2010

Boomie: <jepflast: ...your line...>

Heh. I wish. I just selected the most played moves out of the OE. It does seem like a solid line. I've been trying to keep the Sticky up to date so I see most of the lines teamies mention. Once we get out of the opening, I'm not going to be nearly as helpful...heh.

AylerKupp: < AT spreadsheet (ATSS) Update, May-02-13>

The next ATSS update is ready for downloading from the following RapidShare link. This download link is also posted in the Sticky.

http://rapidshare.com/files/3613249...

This version of the ATSS contains all the posted analyses through May-02-13, 5:00 PM PDT, just after Black's 3rd move (3...cxd4) was posted. It contains 11 applicable analyses, 2 with evaluations. So, once again, a reminder that, in order for the analyses recorded in the ATSS to be really useful, you should include your assessment of the position at the end of the analysis. It may be obvious to you but it may not be obvious to someone else, or they may have a different opinion and assume that their opinion matches yours. Both may result in desirable discussions not happening.

Since all of our analyzed responses involved 3...cxd4, I moved all the analyses to the W04 move tab and deleted the B03 move tab. This helps keep the ATSS small.

Our most likely move will be 4.Nxd4 and then we'll just have to see what variation Black chooses. Also, since the number of posted analyses with an evaluation is still small, the statistics are not meaningful so I didn't bother posting them. And, of course, the statistics may not meaningful anyway.

AylerKupp: <Supplementary Games spreadsheet (SGSS) Update, May-02-13>

The next SGSS update is ready for downloading from the following RapidShare link. This download link is also posted in the Sticky.

http://rapidshare.com/files/1187158...

This version of the SGSS contains all the posted games through May-02-13, 5:00 PM PDT, just after Black's 3rd move (3...cxd4) was posted. It contains 2 applicable games for White’s next move but the next update will contain more games.

Even though the spreadsheet is not very large at the moment, I decided to also compress it and post it in *.zip format, just to be consistent with the ATSS post format. You'll thank me once the SGSS gets bigger, as I hope that it will.

Again, as our game progresses, if you have any games that you consider noteworthy, preferably master level correspondence games, please post them in the main page in PGN format or provide a link to them.

AylerKupp: <crawfb5> I'm not surprised that games starting with 1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 e5 5.Nb5 d6 6.Bg5 Qxg5 7.Nc7+ show a preponderance of wins for Black.

click for larger view

Usually White's knight gets trapped after 7...Kd8 8.Nxa8 b6 and 9...Bb7. After 10.Nxb6 axb6 Black has B+N vs. R+P and in the middle game two minor pieces usually beat R+P, particularly if the rooks don't have enough open files to use.

Similar positions occur in the Sveshnikov after moves such as ...a6, ...b5, Bf1xb5, ...axb5, Nc3xb5 and Nb5xc7+. We need to avoid lines which may look attractive on the surface but not shown to be superior through analyses. One must be prepared in Sicilian's!

stunningmove: Hesam7

I see the branching tree opening choices listed. There is one more solid choice:

4...Qb6 (the Grivas) has the highest winning Black percentage and is not well known. It would be interesting in a non computer game. The idea of the Grivas is to force the WN back to b3 immediately. At GM level no other Black 4th move wins more than 20%, the Grivas has a 45% black win percentage at GM levels.

Here is a sample game from earlier this year

Smeets, Jan (2631) vs Fedorchuk, Sergey A. (2643)

Date: 2013-02-10
Event: 73rd Noteboom Mem, Leiden NED
Round: 5.1
Result: 0-1
Opening: Sicilian Defense, Godiva Variation (B32)

1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. d4 cxd4 4. Nxd4 Qb6 5. Nb3 Nf6 6. Nc3 e6 7. Qe2 d6 8. g4 a6 9. Be3 Qc7 10. g5 Nd7 11. f4 b5 12. Qf2 Rb8 13. O-O-O Nb6 14. Kb1 Bd7 15. h4 b4 16. Ne2 a5 17. Ned4 a4 18. Nb5 Qb7 19. Nc1 Nc8 20. Nd4 N8a7 21. h5 Rc8 22. Bd3 b3 23. cxb3 Nb4 24. Qf3 axb3 25. Ncxb3 Nac6 26. Be2 e5 27. Nxc6 Bxc6 28. Nd2 d5 29. fxe5 dxe4 30. Qf5 Bd5 31. Bc4 Rxc4 32. Nxc4 Bxc4 33. Rc1 Bxa2+ 34. Ka1 Be6 35. Qxe6+ fxe6 36. Kb1 Qa6 37. Rc3 Qa2+ 38. Kc1 Qa1+ 39. Kd2 Qxb2+ 40. Kd1 Qxc3 41. Bd2 Qc2+ 42. Ke2 Qd3+ 43. Ke1 Nc2+ 44. Kd1 e3 45. Kc1 Qxd2+ 46. Kb2 Nd4+ 47. Kb1 Qc2+ 48. Ka1 Nb3#

Our fourth move is coming quickly and we will need to decide as soon as possible what direction to take the game.

cro777: A top level CC game, in the Sveshnikov Variation (4...Nf6 5.Nc3 e5), from the ongoing Bielecki Memorial at

http://www.iccf.com/MakeAMove.aspx?...

Ron Langeveld is 26th Correspondence World Champion. Currently, he is 2nd highest rated correspondence player in the world.

The most recent CC game on higher level, in the Kalashnikov Variation (4...e5), from the ongoing 4th Danube Cup (Ukraine-Poland, Board 1) at

http://www.iccf-webchess.com/MakeAM...

After 6.N1c3 the Kalashnikov often transposes into the Sveshnikov.

The Danube Cup is an invitational team tournament, organised by the Correspondence Chess Association of the Czech Republic in memory of Paul Darmogray (1934-2006; as the great enthusiast of chess, he was particularly active in organising and playing of international matches). In the first place, this tournament was intended for the countries which the river Danube flows through or where it creates state frontiers. Target category for Board 1 is Elo 2501+.

Boomie: <stunningmove: 4...Qb6>

White has a promising looking pawn sac with 5. Be3

1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. d4 cxd4 4. Nxd4 Qb6 5. Be3 Qxb2 6. Nb3 Qe5 7. Bd3

click for larger view

I don't know if it's a refutation of Qb6 but white has a lead in development for the pawn. Plus white wins another tempo with the useful f4 at some point.

stunningmove: Boomie
The pawn sac has never been played at a GM level. I'd love to see them play it!! Here's how I might answer

1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Qb6 5. Be3?! Qxb2 6.Nb3

click for larger view

Nf6! 7. Bd3 d5 8. N1d2 Qe5 9. Nf3 Qc7 10. exd5 Nxd5 11. Qd2 e5

click for larger view

Black has a pawn and the advantage. There is a very good chance of them trying it because OE gives it as white winning more games. These were all lower level games however and we might really surprise them in this line.

Hesam7: <stunningmove: Hesam7

I see the branching tree opening choices listed. There is one more solid choice:

4...Qb6 (the Grivas) has the highest winning Black percentage and is not well known.>

I am not so sure, from 5 Nb3 Nf6 6 Nc3 e6

click for larger view

White scores 58.7% with 7 Bd3.

Hesam7: <stunningmove> even if they don't expect 4...Qb6, all they need to do is pick up a repertoire book for White. For example "Opening for White according to Anand, Vol. 9" dedicates 18 pages to Grivas and recommends 5 Nb3 Nf6 6 Nc3 e6 7 Qe2.

After 5 Be3 Qb2 White can also play 6 Nc6.

stunningmove: Hesam7. You have to be careful which database you use. I use Chesstempo.com which is more complete and can analyze based on player ratings. In this position

click for larger view

Here are the 3 main move % wins at a GM (2600+) level

7. Qe2 22/22/56
7. Bd3 17/50/33
7. Be3 0/33/67

stunningmove: kwid, boomie, Hesam7

I'm not a champion of the Grivas just see it as interesting.

Here is a much more detailed pgn of the 7.Qe2 line which I see as the critical test. Look it over see what you think

[Event "US Championship, Saint Louis"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2010.05.15"]
[Round "2"]
[White "Robson, Ray"]
[Black "Yermolinsky, Alex"]
[Result "0-1"]
[BlackElo "2528"]
[ECO "B33"]
[Opening "Sicilian"]
[Variation "Open, 2...Nc6, 5...Qb6 6.Nb3 e6"]
[WhiteElo "2569"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "58"]
[WhiteType "human"]
[BlackType "human"]

1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. d4 cxd4 4. Nxd4 Qb6 5. Nb3 Nf6 6. Nc3 e6 7. Qe2 Bb4 8. Bd2 O-O 9. a3 $1 ♕uite a critical test. Be7 ♗lack's usual choice. The alternative is #9. .. Bxc3 $6 10. Bxc3 e5 , giving up the bishop-pair, but blunting White's queenside minor pieces. However, after 11. O-O-O I'm far from convinced that ♗lack can equalise: Re8 #11. .. Rd8 12. Rd6 $1 is an important point, after which Van Delft has pointed out the key line Qc7 13. Rxf6 gxf6 14. Qg4+ Kh8 15. Qh4 with excellent play for the exchange# #likewise, I'm rather suspicious of ♗lack's position after 11. .. d6 $6 12. Rxd6 $1 Nd4 13. Rxd4 exd4 14. Bxd4 Qc6 15. e5 when again White enjoys highly-promising play for the exchange# 12. f3 d6 13. Rxd6 #of course!# Nd4 14. Rxd4 exd4 15. Bxd4 Qc6 16. Qb5 many would have preferred to keep queens on with #16. Qf2 followed by pushing the kingside pawns# 16. .. Qxb5 17. Bxb5 Bd7 was seen in Georgiadis-Zubarev, ♖ethymnon 2010, and now White should have retained the bishop-pair and more than enough for the exchange, despite the absence of the queens, after 18. Bd3 .# 10. O-O-O This looks like the most precise continuation. Instead #10. g4 10. .. d5 $1 11. g5 Nxe4 12. Nxe4 dxe4 13. Qxe4 e5 14. h4 would have given ♗lack good counterplay in Abdulov-♔hurtsidze, Canakkale 2010, had she gone in for the bold g6 $1 followed by ...♗f5.# #White has also tried 10. e5 , but after Nd5 11. g3 or #11. Nxd5 exd5 12. O-O-O Qc7 13. f4 d6 with sufficient counterplay# 11. .. d6 12. exd6 Bxd6 13. Bg2 Be5 ♗lack was able to equalise in Zdebskaja-♙etrov, Tromso 2010.# 10. .. d5 $5 ♗lack's most ambitious try. Instead #10. .. d6 $6 11. g4 a6 12. g5 Nd7 13. h4 Qc7 14. f4 $1 left White clearly ahead in the attacking stakes in no lesser game than Anand-♔ramnik, Mainz #blitz# 2001,# #but ♗lack might prefer to first regroup his queen with ♔urajica's 10. .. Qc7 {. Indeed, if it turns out that White is just better after 10...d5, I suspect that this is the direction in which more Grivas aficionados will turn

stunningmove: pgn continued

11. Be3 ♘atural
enough, but taking play into a French structure with #11. e5 $5 Nd7 as I've pointed out before in the notes to Tukhaev-Oleksienko, #11. .. Ne8 $5 doesn't block the light-squared bishop and also covers the d6-square against any ♘b5 ideas Vokarov-Golod, ♙lovdiv 2008, continued 12. Be3 Qc7 13. f4 f6 14. Nb5 Qb8 15. exf6 Nxf6 16. N5d4 and now ♗lack broke with e5 17. fxe5 Qxe5 and equalised# 12. f4 appears to favour White: Nc5 or #12. .. a6 13. Be3 Qc7 14. Qh5 $1 b5 15. Bd3 g6 16. Qh6 b4 17. h4 $3 Re8 18. h5 Bf8 19. Qg5 h6 20. Qg3 and in Ootes-Siebrecht, Wijk aan Zee 2009, ♗lack was overwhelmed on the kingside# 13. Nxc5 Qxc5 14. h4 Bd7 15. Be1 Rfc8 was seen in Van Delft-♘everov, Dieren 2010, and now Van Delft's suggestion of 16. Rh3 $5 may well be the best way to demonstrate that it is White who has the upper hand.# 11. .. Qc7 12. exd5 Nxd5 $1 ♗lack clears the f6-square for his bishop. Instead White should have a small but clear edge after #12. .. exd5 13. g3 Re8 14. Bg2 .# 13. Nxd5 exd5 14. g3 $1 A very logical and likely rather strong novelty. White can also try to increase the pressure with #14. Qh5 when 14. .. Be6 #14. .. g6 $5 may appear weakening, but there's no reason not to continue offering the d-pawn and if White declines with, say, 15. Qh6 then Ne5 16. Be2 Ng4 17. Bxg4 Bxg4 doesn't seem too bad for ♗lack who will obtain counterplay down the central files# 15. Nd4 Nxd4 16. Bxd4 Bf6 $1 17. Bxf6 Qf4+ 18. Rd2 Qxf6 19. Bd3 g6 20. Qh6 Rfc8 21. h4 $1 gave him an edge in Mijovic-Haznedaroglu, Antalya 2009.# #We should also examine what happens if White grabs the pawn: 14. Rxd5 14. .. Be6 15. Rd1 Rfd8 16. Nd4 this opens the c-file for ♗lack, but in any case the second player is pretty active, with #16. Kb1 Bf6 17. Rxd8+ Rxd8 18. f4 Qc8 $5 , preparing ideas of ...♗f5 or ...♗g4, as well as an exchange on b3 followed by ...♕e6, another way to increase the pressure# 16. .. Nxd4 17. Bxd4 $6 #17. Rxd4 Bf6 18. Rxd8+ Rxd8 19. Qb5 looks like a better defence# 17. .. Rac8 gave ♗lack a strong initiative before White collapsed with 18. Be5 $2 in Tirto-♘adanian, ♔uala Lumpur 2006, and now ♗lack could have won on the spot with Bg5+ 19. Kb1 Qxe5

stunningmove: rest of pgn

$1
.# #Finally, the more uncompromising extended fianchetto with 14. g4 $5 was preferred in Movsesian-Grivas, ♙anormo 2001, which remained rather complex after Rd8 the active #14. .. Ne5 $5 looks more to the point# 15. Bg2 Be6 16. Kb1 Rac8 17. f4 Movsesian later suggested #17. h3 $5 and after Bf6 18. c3 White has an edge# 17. .. d4 $5 18. Bc1 the critical test was #18. Nxd4 $5 Nxd4 19. Bxd4 Qxf4 20. Bxb7 , but after Qxg4 21. Qxg4 Bxg4 22. Bxc8 Bxd1 23. Rxd1 Bf6 $1 24. c3 Bxd4 25. Rxd4 Rxc8 26. Rd7 f5 ♗lack retains decent counterplay right into the endgame# 18. .. d3 19. Rxd3 Rxd3 20. Qxd3 Bxg4 by when ♗lack had sufficient counterplay.# 14. .. Bf5 $5 Yermolinsky isn't worried about the d-pawn. Instead in his notes to his game with Grivas, Movsesian mentioned #14. .. Be6 15. Bg2 Rfd8 16. Nd4 Bf6 without giving an assessment. ♗lack is quite solid here, but with 17. Rhe1 Bxd4 18. Bxd4 Rac8 19. c3 White can claim an edge# #Again I also wondered about 14. .. Ne5 $5 , but after 15. Bf4 $1 Bd6 16. Bg2 Bg4 17. f3 Bf5 18. Nd4 White is slightly for choice.# 15. Bg2 After #15. Rxd5 I suspect that ♗lack should go Be6 in any case, since #15. .. Be4 $6 16. Bf4 $1 Bxd5 17. Bxc7 Bxh1 18. Bh3 likely favours White's active pieces and queen over the black rooks.## 15. .. Rac8 16. Bf4 $4 ♘ot a bad move from a positional viewpoint, but ♖obson has badly underestimated the pressure against c2. He also had to avoid #16. Bxd5 $2 16. .. Nb4 $1 17. axb4 Qxc2+ 18. Qxc2 Rxc2+ 19. Kb1 Rc6+ 20. Ka2 Ra6+ 21. Na5 Bxb4 when ♗lack regains his piece with some advantage,# #but he might have whisked the king away with 16. Kb1 when 16. .. Ne5 there doesn't seem to be any way in for ♗lack down the a-file after #16. .. Nb4 $2 17. axb4 Bxc2+ 18. Ka2# 17. Nd4 Bg4 18. f3 Bd7 would have been about equal.# #However, the critical test must be 16. Rxd5 $1 Be6 or #16. .. Ne5 17. Nd4 Bd3 $5 18. Qd1 Bg6 19. Kb1 and White is defending# 17. Rb5 when White's rook looks a little precarious after a6 18. Rb6 , but I haven't managed to find anything especially good for ♗lack here. He might fight to keep White's rook imprisoned with Bd7 , but after 19. Rd1 Rfe8 20. Be4 does he really have enough for the pawn? I suspect not, but fans of the Grivas Variation may wish to try to prove me wrong!# 16. .. Qb6 17. Rxd5 $5 I doubt that ♖obson missed ♗lack's next rather I suspect that he considered this a better practical try than #17. Rd2 Bb4 $1 18. Rd3 #18. axb4 $2 Nxb4 19. c3 Na2+ 20. Kd1 Rxc3 $1 gives ♗lack a huge attack# 18. .. Bxd3 19. Qxd3 Bc5 when White clearly hasn't anywhere near enough for the exchange.# 17. .. Bxc2 $1 18. Qxc2 Na5 ♙ossibly not the best option. Instead after #18. .. Ne5 $5 had White tried 19. Nc5 Bxc5 20. Kb1 Bxa3 21. Qd2 $2 then ♗lack would have had Qg6+ followed by a crushing invasion on c2.# 19. Nxa5 $6 Thanks to the loose knight on a5, White won't obtain enough for the queen. Thus he should have preferred #19. Nc5 , scary though ♗lack's attack may appear after Bxc5 20. Kb1 Bxa3 . That said, after 21. Qd2 Nc4 #21. .. Qg6+ can now be met by 22. Qd3# 22. Qd4 White is fighting and this looks like a better try than the game.# 19. .. Rxc2+ 20. Kxc2 Qxf2+ 21. Rd2 Qc5+ 22. Kb1 Qxa5 Thus ♗lack has a queen and pawn for the rook and bishop. White's pieces might seem quite well placed, but his king remains exposed and Yermolinsky now made no mistake: 23. Rc1 b5 $1 24. Rd7 Bf6 25. Bd6 $4 It really wasn't ♖obson's day. Instead something like #25. Bd5 would have enabled him to fight on for a while longer.# 25. .. Qd2 $1 26. Rc2 Qd1+ 27. Rc1 Qd3+ 28. Rc2 Re8 The arrival of ♗lack's remaining piece heralds the end. 29. Bc6 Re1+ 0-1

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