ARCHIVED POSTS
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 830 OF 1118 ·
Later Kibitzing> |
| Jun-17-15 | | Abdel Irada: It's not just personal attacks. Those are bad enough, but the racism is off the charts. Why do you find profanity sufficient cause to delete posts, and off-color humor intolerable enough to lock trusted members' forums until they delete it, but put up with posts that make me ashamed to tell black friends about this site? Guideline 1 explicitly forbids racist language, but as far as I know it is *never* enforced. Please address this issue.
∞ |
|
Jun-17-15
 | | chessgames.com: A few weeks ago a user was placed on probation for a racist comment on the Rogoff page. Somebody said something way over the line, two people blew the whistle, and probation began immediately. However, there have not been any whistles on the Rogoff page in the past week, at least none that are accusations of racism. So please use the normal channels before you come here. |
|
| Jun-17-15 | | Abdel Irada: I have used the "normal channels" even when it is plain that to do so is worse than futile. So have dozens of other members, and they are all fast reaching the same conclusion. We can pretend all is sweetness and light if we like, but I will tell you plainly that *nowhere* else I go, from Facebook to Al Jazeera to Ha'aretz to the Daily Mail, is so persistently disfigured by completely unregulated hate speech and gibbering mania as this site. Have you noticed I haven't been here nearly as much as I used to be? Have you noticed the same of some other members (some of whom have been here for many years) who are getting sick of seeing lunatics roam the asylum, accosting them at will? I was about to say this anyway, but your last sentence added impetus to my disgust. Just how this started I don't know; maybe chessplayers just tend to be more aggressive or more passionate or more articulate in expressing their emotions than most people. But I can definitely tell you how it got this bad: because you let it. I have been telling you for over a year now, both privately (for the most part) and publicly (when sufficiently annoyed by your non-responses), that you need to take control over your site. Well, I don't doubt that you will now restore an illusion of such control, and placate the chorus of my detractors who will howl in rage over this post, by silencing me. But make no mistake: This is an illusion. Your site is in crisis, and you're sitting in here talking about coding and classification. Nero could scarcely be more oblivious.
∞ |
|
| Jun-17-15 | | zanzibar: Poor <chessgames> has so many demands in so many directions. I would think the Rogoff flame wars would play themselves out soon enough. But I could be wrong. I used to think <Abdel> had patience as boundless as the oceans are deep. |
|
| Jun-18-15 | | Abdel Irada: Would that this were so!
The oceans are deep, but even they are not inexhaustible. And if this is so, then how much more easily depleted are the far shallower reserves of human patience? I understand that Daniel has many demands, but I also know that this site has long ceased to be a place of peace for me and many others. If you had black friends, Muslim friends, Hispanic friends who played chess, would you advise them to come to this site? Because, in good conscience, I can't. This isn't about flame wars. Flame wars are weather. Persistent, unrelieved smoldering hate for ethnic or religious minorities is climate. Weather can be outlasted; climate cannot. But I'm not going to say any more about this just now. Daniel will do as he feels he should; it is his site. And meanwhile, I've plenty of work to do on my own site. I will not be bored. :-) ∞ |
|
| Jun-18-15 | | coolconundrum: Get a grip abdel. |
|
| Jun-18-15 | | zanzibar: <If you had black friends, Muslim friends, Hispanic friends who played chess, would you advise them to come to this site? Because, in good conscience, I can't.> I agree, until we get the games properly normalized, I couldn't recommend this site to any of my friends using the above classifications - or my Asian or Caucasian friends either! ;^] (I almost never use emoticons, but here's a rare exception) Of course I'm kidding. But it's sad to see Abdel's enjoyment of the site so affected. He is one of the denizens of the site, whose posts I've come to expect to see every day I visit here. |
|
| Jun-18-15 | | Abdel Irada: No, <coolconundrum>. One self-gripper per conversation is enough. ∞ |
|
| Jun-18-15 | | Abdel Irada: Er, thank you, <zanzibar>, although I note that you don't quite say you *enjoy* them. :-D ∞ |
|
| Jun-18-15 | | Abdel Irada: <chessgames.com: A few weeks ago a user was placed on probation for a racist comment on the Rogoff page. Somebody said something way over the line, two people blew the whistle, and probation began immediately.> In any case, I am glad to hear this.
The general impression is that nothing is done about racist speech, and it's good to hear otherwise in this case. ∞ |
|
| Jun-18-15 | | TheFocus: If someone blows the whistle, why don't the Admins check out the few pages preceding the offensive post? Then they might delete a lot more posts. Instead, they act on the offensive post and leave the fifty or sixty other offensive posts alone. Truly, this is no way to run an asylum. |
|
| Jun-18-15 | | zanzibar: Do you think <chessgames> wants to spend all day moderating the forums? Isn't the solution for premium users to stage discussions on their own forum where they can act as ultimate moderators? |
|
Jun-18-15
 | | chessgames.com: < TheFocus: If someone blows the whistle, why don't the Admins check out the few pages preceding the offensive post? > We certainly do, but on a forum like Rogoff how far back to you want us to go? We'll inevitably see some heated argument that involves ethnicity in a marginally-acceptable format, that devolves into race baiting and then finally full-blown racial epithets. Anyhow, a change was recently made. You won't see the Rogoff link on the homepage any more. The regulars know how to get there; the new comers are best to not even be aware of it. |
|
| Jun-19-15 | | TheFocus: <Anyhow, a change was recently made. You won't see the Rogoff link on the homepage any more. The regulars know how to get there; the new comers are best to not even be aware of it.> Yes. That would be a big help. |
|
Jun-19-15
 | | chessgames.com: It is a good idea and I don't know why I didn't think of it earlier. While I'm at it, I think Edmund Beronio's page deserves similar treatment. |
|
Jun-19-15
 | | offramp: That really is a good idea. Please also do it for Beronio, Jeremy Lim and Federer. |
|
| Jun-19-15 | | whiteshark: Sometimes it pays to recycle good ideas... ;) |
|
| Jun-19-15 | | zanzibar: The dark web comes to <CG>. |
|
Jun-19-15
 | | Penguincw: My 2 cents:
Do it to the So page as well. However, can you also remove it from the "Recent Kibitzing Page"? Recent Kibitzing Page |
|
Jun-21-15
 | | Fusilli: I have a suggestion for the Opening Exlporer, though it may be programming-intensive (I know nothing about programming). Would it be possible to allow for:
a) Constraining the opening tree to specific years (with the idea of looking only at relatively recent games to see what people are playing today, rather than what has ever been played)? b) Selecting only games above certain rating threshold, in order to see what top players play, rather than everybody? As an example, consider the main line in the closed Ruy Lopez at black's move 9: Opening Explorer As of now, there are 3,467 games with 9...Na5, and only 1,852 with 9...Nb8. If we look at the 2015 games with each move, they come out about the same number of times. Yet, if we look at the games, it is clear that top players prefer 9...Nb8. The reason why 9...Na5 appears to be so much popular if we look at stats only is because it is the older move (1902 for its first appearance, versus 1954 for 9...Nb8) and the opening tree does not discriminate by rating, title, or any other criteria. I would be thrilled if these changes could be implemented. I suspect I wouldn't be the only one. |
|
| Jun-21-15 | | Abdel Irada: <Fusilli>: Whether it would be particularly difficult to do that, I don't know, but I for one would prefer that it wasn't done. I'd have no problem with adding some mechanism (if feasible) to show trends in opening preferences among leading players, but I believe constraining the results to show *only* recent games by the elite would be a mistake. Here's why: Opening preferences don't necessarily reflect objective superiority; often, they are essentially matters of fashion, as different variations go in and out of style. Sometimes a line is under a cloud and is later rehabilitated; other times, it really is just a matter of what's popular at a given time. Either way, such preferences are "subject to change without notice." In fact, if you look at what some of our top players have done lately, you'll see they've enjoyed success by reviving long-dormant lines, such as the Guioco Pianissimo, the Scotch and even the Bishop's Opening. This was done by looking at old games containing these unfavored lines and seeking ways to improve on what the old players did. I think some of us here might like to have a similar option available, and it wouldn't be if the game selection were constrained by date and rating. ∞ |
|
Jun-21-15
 | | Fusilli: <Abdel> Of course, I am suggesting it as an option. I want to have the option of constraining the opening tree. I don't want to deprive anyone else from looking at the whole thing. I would love to have the option. <they are essentially matters of fashion> I agree, and I'm interested in keeping up with fashion. I've always been a stylish fellow ;) |
|
| Jun-21-15 | | Abdel Irada: Oh, absolutely. I'm always in favor of options.
(But I'm not a fashionable fellow. Maybe it's because I'm an Aspergian, but I frankly take little to no notice of what anyone else is wearing — unless, of course, she's female and wearing very little. Of that, too, I am always in favor. :-D )
∞ |
|
| Jun-21-15 | | crawfb5: <M> As a premium member, you can download as much of the CG database as you like via the Zipfile Archive. Go to the Premium Membership page and follow the links. CG updates this a couple of times a year. You can stay more current with the free downloads at This Week in Chess. I started with CG and a couple of other sources for older games and update with TWIC and ICCF. A good database program should be able to do what you want. If you don't have one, SCID is a nice (and free). Zanzibar, hms123, and I are three users of which I am aware, although there may be others. |
|
Jun-21-15
 | | Fusilli: <crawfb5> Yes, but you are underestimating how lazy I am. :) This is practically the only chess website I look at, except for chess.com sometimes only to read news. So, I am hoping that <CG> can continue to be my all-purpose resource. (But of course I also have my engine...) |
|
 |
 |
ARCHIVED POSTS
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 830 OF 1118 ·
Later Kibitzing> |