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Jun-26-09
 | | Phony Benoni: Speaking of fielding feats and defeats, here's a boxscore I ran into the other day: http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/... Looks pretty ordinary? Something happened for the first time in the twentieth century in this game, and it's only occurred a few times since. |
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| Jun-26-09 | | Jim Bartle: You've got me stumped. A 7-4-3 double play? |
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Jun-26-09
 | | Phony Benoni: Take a look at the fielding totals for Chicago's first baseman, Bud Clancy. |
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| Jun-26-09 | | Jim Bartle: Aha! So I guess the Sox pitcher could be classified as "fly ball." |
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Jun-26-09
 | | Phony Benoni: Which it sounds like what the Mets could use these days! Tigers up 4-1 in the 3rd, with Verlander on the mound but not looking sharp. |
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Jun-27-09
 | | Phony Benoni: <Game of the Day>: June 27, 1963 http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/... "Money for Nothing".
(If you looked up the Bud Clancy game yesterday, you'll understand.) |
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| Jun-27-09 | | Jim Bartle: Kaline, Colavito and Cash as the heart of the order. Almost like Mays/McCovey/Hart or Mantle/Maris/Skowron. Vic Power 1b. Did he get his chicks for free? Wouldn't surprise me. Every notice how players don't reflect their names? Vic had no Power, and Horace had no Speed, Johnny rarely sat on the Bench. Reggie never played for Cleveland, nor Daryl for Boston. There are more examples I've forgotten. Mark did have some Grace, though. |
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| Jun-27-09 | | Jim Bartle: And who was that guy who pinch hit for Mossi? |
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Jun-27-09
 | | Phony Benoni: <And who was that guy who pinch hit for Mossi?> I'm not sure, but I'll bet the girl appreciated it. |
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Jun-27-09
 | | Phony Benoni: On the other hand, Johnny was Sain, and Willie Miranda was a switch-hitter so he had rights as well as lefts. (Please, please, please--don't get me started on a name game! I'll be here all day!) |
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| Jun-27-09 | | Jim Bartle: Neither Cecil was nor Prince is a good Fielder.
And I'm not convinced he really is a Prince, either. |
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Jun-27-09
 | | Phony Benoni: Rollie did have Fingers, Bill Hands, and ElRoy a Face. However, I'm sure Barry had more than one Foote, and at 6' 4" Chris wasn't Short. |
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| Jun-27-09 | | Jim Bartle: No matter how many times he was ready to knock down his grandmother, Early Wynn still had 244 losses, many of them quite late, I would guess. |
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| Jun-27-09 | | Travis Bickle: <Jim Bartle> Speaking of head hunters Don Drysdale would knock down his mother if she was crowding the plate. |
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| Jun-27-09 | | Travis Bickle: The General Manager move of the year, trading Mark DeRosa for Milton Bradley showed it's ugly head yesterday. http://chicago.cubs.mlb.com/news/ar... |
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| Jun-27-09 | | Jim Bartle: My apologies for being unclear. I believe Wynn was not talking about throwing a beanball at this grandmother, but knocking her down at home if he was trying to score the winning run. |
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| Jun-27-09 | | Jim Bartle: Any nominations for the biggest trades in baseball history--players only, no cash, big names on both sides? (Not eligible is George Carlin's 1964 "Today the San Francisco Giants traded Willie Mays to the New York Mets, in exchange for the entire New York Mets team.") Some possibilities, mainly from 1960 onwards:
* Fred McGriff and Tony Fernandez of Toronto, to San Diego for Roberto Alomar and Joe Carter. *Joe Morgan, Cesar Geronimo, Denis Menke, Ed Armbrister and Jack Billingham to Cincinnati from Houston for Lee May, Tommy Helms and Jimmy Stewart. *Ted Simmons, Pete Vuckovich, and Rollie Fingers from St. Louis to Milwaukee for David Green, Sixto Lezcano, Lary Sorensen and Dave LaPoint. I thought this was a disaster for the Cards, but it worked out well for both teams. *Ozzie Smith, Steve Mura and Al Olmsted from San Diego to St. Louis for Sixto Lezcano, Garry Templeton and Luis DeLeon. Another one I thought was a disaster for the Cards. *Roger Maris, Joe DeMaestri and Kent Hadley from KC to NY for Don Larsen, Hank Bauer, Norm Siebern and Marv Throneberry. * Larry Bowa and Ryne Sandberg from Philadelphia to Cubs for Ivan DeJesus. I thought getting Bowa for DeJesus was already a win for the Cubs, and getting a little-known infielder with some potential in addition was just too much. *Joe DiMaggio from NY to Boston for Ted Williams. (Oops, guess that one never happened.) *Curt Flood, Tim McCarver, Byron Browne, Joe Hoerner and Willie Montanez from St. Louis to Philadelphia for Jerry Johnson, Dick Allen and Cookie Rojas. Historic, of course, as Flood refused to be traded and started the whole free-agent era, even though he lost his case. * Rogers Hornsby from St. Louis to Giants for Frankie Frisch and Jimmy Ring. *Kareem Abdul-Jabbar and Walt Wesley from Milwaukee to LA for Junior Bridgeman, Dave Meyers, Brian Winters and Elmore Smith. Oops, wrong sport. *Frank Robinson from Cincinnati to Baltimore for Milt Pappas. *Orlando Cepeda from SF to St. Louis for Ray Sadecki. *Gaylord Perry from SF to Cleveland for Sam McDowell. |
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Jun-27-09
 | | Phony Benoni: <Travis Bickle> You have to take Milton Bradley seriously. He doesn't play games. <Jim Bartle> You've covered most of the big ones I can think of offhand. But the one that stands out in every Tigers' fan was the 1960 deal with the Indians of Mike Demeter for Norm Cash. Oh wait--you said no Cash involved. And I guess Mike Demeter's not that big a name, as he played exactly five major league games after the trade. How about this 1954 trade between the Orioles and Yankees: Don Larsen, Bob Turley, Billy Hunter, Mike Blyzka, Darrell Johnson, Jim Fridley and Dick Kryhoski for Gene Woodling, Harry Byrd, Jim McDonald, Hal Smith, Gus Triandos, Willie Miranda, Bill Miller, Kal Segrist, Don Leppert and Ted Del Guercio. A lot of names, if not a lot of big names. And then there was the famous Max Flack for Cliff Heatcote trade. Check these two boxscores, from a doubleheader: http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/...
http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/... The trade seems have benefitted both players, they went hitless in the first game but got hits with their new teams in the second game. |
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| Jun-27-09 | | Jim Bartle: I'd always thought Cash was a Tiger farm product. In fact, I thought the entire Detroit team (starters, I mean) in the 68 series was homegrown. That Orioles-Yankees trade was huge, and there were a lot of good players in there: Turley, Larsen, Woodling, Triandos. I do wonder how the GMs figured those trades, who had what value, what they had to get in return for what they were giving up. At least back then salaries and contracts weren't a consideration. I think Triandos was desperate to get out of NY, where there was no future. Berra, and then Howard. |
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Jun-27-09
 | | Phony Benoni: Yes, outside of Cash, all the Tigers starters in 1968 were homegrown--as well as most of the major reserve players. Dick Tracezewski and Eddie Mathews were about the only exceptions. Most of the pitching staff were Detroit originals as well. Earl Wilson was the only starter from outside the system, and guys like Don McMahon and John Wyatt idd some of the relief work. |
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| Jun-28-09 | | A.G. Argent: And Bob could Walk. |
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| Jun-28-09 | | A.G. Argent: Yeah, <TB> and now DeRosa is a Cardinal as of yesterday. Sorry, old son, of course you must hate that as much as the Bradley trade but it makes yer ol' pal AG happy. Got him for a song too. Although, a lot of utitlity guys have been doing quite nice lately waiting for the carrot-on-a-stick return of Glaus and the subsequent constant juggling of the infield by LaRussa so it'll be interesting to see how he fits in. But what a luxury. He's gotta be a boon. (Oh man, dast I?....... Bob was a Boone?) Never mind. |
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| Jun-28-09 | | playground player: <Jim Bartle> Gaylord Perry for Sodden Sam McDowell--thank you so much for bringing that up! Would you also like to give me a nice paper-cut? |
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| Jun-28-09 | | Jim Bartle: Sorry about that. At least I didn't mention George Foster for Frank Duffy. |
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Jun-28-09
 | | Phony Benoni: Speaking of the name game...
I was looking in on the Tigers' game at one of the scoreboard websites, and saw listed among the pitchers in the bullpen "Ni". Some sort of computer glitch, I thought. Then I learned that the Tigers had just brought up a new pitcher from Toledo, <Fu-Te Ni>. Actually, I guess he's not originally from Toledo. |
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