< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 3 OF 3 ·
|Dec-17-07|| ||TheaN: <Still, I think that a 3-ply goes a bit deep for Monday so I'll take the point.>|
...in the end, Monday is about the Queen sac and/or an easy piece win. Both happen here.
The odd thing is, that I know this position from the Dutch Stappenmethode FAFAIK, but I haven't found it yet.
|Dec-17-07|| ||Marvol: "How to dismantle an atomic Bohm"?|
|Dec-17-07|| ||whiteshark: Hey, hey Captain Hans!
Grab your , you have no chance!
|Dec-17-07|| ||newton296: seems hard for monday.
the first move is easy , but there is still some work after ...Qxn f3
|Dec-17-07|| ||tatarch: Good easy puzzle, but the line in the game is also worth noting as I feel that the position after 7.d3 comes up all the time in the exchange ruy lopez-- or at least it does in the blitz games I play. The Ne2# threat is a strong weapon for white to keep in mind.|
|Dec-17-07|| ||MaczynskiPratten: Not a Monday puzzle in my opinion. Yes, Qxg5 is obvious, but Black was a piece down so it merely restores equality - not an "easy piece win". f3 is a clear defence and then you have to spot Nh3+ instead of Nh2, followed by Bc5. And find the right way to defeat Nh3+ 14 Kh2!? Qxe3 15 Nc4. Were chessgames.com fooled by White's quick resignation into thinking this was simpler?|
|Dec-17-07|| ||MaczynskiPratten: Plus after Qf3 you have to spot Qxg2+. Still, maybe this is doubly appropriate for Monday with 2 successive Queen sacs!|
|Dec-17-07|| ||MostlyAverageJoe: <dzechiel: this has the feeling of a Wednesday position to me.>|
Well, Hiarcs agrees with you (and with others who thought it was more difficult than usual). There are actually two levels of difficulty that can be given to this puzzle.
To see that Nxg5 at least equalizes: borderline Mon/Tue difficulty.
To see that it actually leads to a win after f3: Wed. level, more difficult part of the spectrum.
This last part makes it the most difficult Monday puzzle since I started running the difficulty evaluations back in March.
|Dec-17-07|| ||YouRang: <TheEnterprise: I found it in under a minute, but I spent the first part of the minute trying to solve for white : / >|
<MrMelad: <TheEnterprise> You see, this is your first mistake, always try to look at a position from a neutral perspective. I think Capa once said that when a chess player looks at a position he has to know instantly who is winning. >
Hmmm. Not sure I understand your meaning. It sounds like you are suggesting that someone should be able to look at a position and know who's winning without even knowing who's turn it is to move.
Of course, this isn't always possible. It is easy to construct a position where either side can win -- depending on whose turn it is to move.
It's probably even possible to construct a mutual zugzwang type of position where either side to move loses! :-)
|Dec-17-07|| ||MostlyAverageJoe: <YouRang: It's probably even possible to construct a mutual zugzwang type of position where either side to move loses!>|
Here's one, known as the 'trebuchet' position
click for larger view
|Dec-17-07|| ||gilbertblondy: g5 menace e2 #|
|Dec-17-07|| ||YouRang: <MostlyAverageJoe> Thanks, I figured that someone would rise to the occasion. :-)|
|Dec-17-07|| ||johnlspouge: 12...Qxg5 13.Qf3 Qxg2+ 14.Qxg2 Ne2#
For those who complain about such things, I apologize. This line is the "second-best play" on White's part, but it's less work than playing on without your queen :)
Time to check the kibitzing.
<MostlyAverageJoe: Here's one, known as the 'trebuchet' position>
Thanks for the name, MAJ. You probably realize by now that I love "culture".
"When I hear the word 'culture' I reach for my gun." - Hans Johst
<kevin86: a Godfather [sacrifice], an offer that cannot be refused.>
A great phrase! Is it common among chessplayers nowadays?
I have not previously spent much time hanging around on the web, and my 10 year-old daughter thinks we are all a little weird, guys. I told her that at least we don't all look like penguins to one another ;>)
|Dec-17-07|| ||lifemate: after 13.f3 Nh3 14.gh3 Qe3 15.Rf2 Bc5, any move from white to protect the pinned rook is followed by the black reply capturing the knight on d2 with the queen and winning a piece, unless i missed something!!|
|Dec-17-07|| ||greystar69: I agree with your analysis <lifemate> since 13.f3 Nh3+ 14.gxh3 Qxe3+ 15.Rf2 Bc5 is followed by a series of exchanges leading to an endgame where black was won the exchange and is a pawn up.
Not totally obvious for a Monday puzzle and not everyone who can solve a Monday puzzle would be able to convert that position to a win!|
|Dec-17-07|| ||lifemate: could you elaborate more <greystar69>,...what series of exchanges?..in the line I mentioned,I only see black a clear piece up...even a whole rook up!!|
|Dec-17-07|| ||Yurys student: f3 Nh3+ gxh3 Qxe3+ Rf2 Bc5 Qg3 Rxh3 (Qxd2?? Qxe5+ =) Qxh3 Qxf2+ Kh1 Qxd2 Qh8+ Bf8 (-4.81) - + Black has an eaily won game!|
|Dec-17-07|| ||DukeAlba: Pretty easy puzzle... The only thing that can go wrong is to think that its white to play....|
That pretty much took about 5 minutes from me until I noticed it was black's move.... then it was much easier!
|Dec-17-07|| ||UdayanOwen: Kevin86 -- thanks for making me laugh with your funny comment about the rook "working from home"...|
|Dec-17-07|| ||porgue: wow i guess i completely overlooked this one.... i hate mondays :P|
|Dec-17-07|| ||johnlspouge: <MostlyAverageJoe: Here's one, known as the 'trebuchet' position>|
I was curious about the derivation of the name of the chess position. Interestingly (to me at least), it does not seem to be named after a game played by Joe Trebuchet, because "Trebuchet" does not hit anything in the chessgames.com database. However,
"...A trebuchet is a siege engine employed in the Middle Ages either to smash masonry walls or to throw projectiles over them. It is sometimes called a 'counterweight trebuchet'..."
Probably, the move "throws" the King away from protecting the pawn, and the opposing King is the counterweight.
This etymology is pure speculation on my part, so if anyone can confirm or deny it, please let me know.
|Dec-17-07|| ||zooter: I probably think anybody who noticed Qxg5 should be given credit even after the (supposedly) tough reply f3.|
Sometimes in chess, you need not calculate all them moves, but its ok to just find the right move at the right time...(IMHO)
|Dec-17-07|| ||Hoozits: "Yurys student: f3 Nh3+ gxh3 Qxe3+ Rf2 Bc5 Qg3 Rxh3 (Qxd2?? Qxe5+ =) Qxh3 Qxf2+ Kh1 Qxd2 Qh8+ Bf8 (-4.81) - + Black has an eaily won game!" I think you need to see this line before obtaining full credit, and thus it probably shouldn't be in a Monday puzzle.|
|Dec-17-07|| ||MKelley: What is wrong with 13.f3 ?|
|Dec-18-07|| ||WannaBe: <MKelley> Read previous posts...|
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