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Mar-30-23
 | | Sally Simpson: Hi Stone,
The author of Ink Wars also identifies McDonnell as someone who likes a good yarn. I read the William Surewitz bit as well (without a doubt a dig at Steinitz) He was bragging he now has the same initials as Shakespeare, Walter Scott and the room filled with merriment when being reminded he also had the same initials as Bill Sykes (the main villain in Oliver Twist). When doing a spoof report on a league match I made up a game played by this lad Hugh R Brechin a silly mate right out of the opening. Hugh was OK about it, it fitted in with the ridiculous events I was describing in the non-existence chess match. However some people actually believed the game took place. |
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Mar-30-23 | | stone free or die: Well, <Sally>, I hope you left clear evidence that the game was a spoof somewhere nearby. I like how the <Neues Wiener Tagblatt> did it for this game, by publishing it on April's Fools Day! <1910-04-01 - Neues Wiener Tagblatt (Tages-Ausgabe) - p11https://anno.onb.ac.at/cgi-content/...
>
(For me, look for one or two !'s somewhere in the vicinity - usually indicating some cheeky tomfoolery is underfoot) |
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Mar-30-23 | | stone free or die: RE: Riddle
https://www.chessarch.com/excavatio... Two columnists, in the same column, over and under , betiding the side by siding. |
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Mar-30-23
 | | Sally Simpson: Hi Stone
< hope you left clear evidence that the game was a spoof somewhere nearby.> Of course not. The game and match report was ridiculous; other members of the team he was playing against were J.Lennon, P. McCartney, G.Harrison and R.Starr. But I was asked at a bookstall months later if the game and match report was genuine. 'No' The lad told me he believed me! |
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Mar-31-23 | | stone free or die: <Sally> You're a regular John McCartney, you are... <Aye, it may be a joke to you, but it's his nose. He can't help having a hideous great hooter! And his poor little head, trembling under the weight of it!> Don't mind me, I'm a mocker. |
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Mar-31-23
 | | jnpope: The <Leeds Mercury Weekly Supplement>, 1884.08.23, does end up publishing the game:
http://www.chessarch.com/excavation...It also published a Steinitz-Pilhal game (giving "Philhal", so there's another variation to search for):
http://www.chessarch.com/excavation... |
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Mar-31-23 | | stone free or die: <JN> fantastic that you found that. Could I please (pretty please with sugar on it) ask you to take another crack at finding the earlier issue they refer to, where they posted notice of this game. That also includes the issue with Grimshaw's original letter, dated July 25th (so maybe published Aug 2nd or Aug 9th)? The only version of the letter I've seen is the one quoted in Steinitz' writings. Obviously finding the original would be very nice. OK, thanks for digging out this find.
PS- I think I saw that "Philhal" version of the player too. I think player biographies should note the various spellings found in the literature as an aid to us investigations. |
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Mar-31-23
 | | jnpope: <Could I please (pretty please with sugar on it) ask you to take another crack at finding the earlier issue they refer to, where they posted notice of this game.> Didn't I do that a week ago?
W Grimshaw vs Steinitz, 1876 (kibitz #143) |
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Mar-31-23 | | stone free or die: Oh yes you did! Bless you.
I must have misplaced it when I was collating my notes. Oooph! My bad, but as "they" say - "All's well that ends well". |
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Mar-31-23 | | stone free or die: FWIW - the chess column was almost always referred to as the <Leeds Weekly Mercury> in the American press. The <Leeds Mercury> did indeed start out as a Saturday weekly, before becoming a daily in 1861. The history of the paper is outlined at BNA: <By 1900 week-day editions contained ten pages, but on Saturdays it included twelve pages and an additional supplement, all priced at only 1d. > https://www.britishnewspaperarchive... I believe that during the entirety of its chess column run there was only one editor <James White> - is this him? James White There's many references to him out there, most of which I've yet to review, but there's an extensive writeup with a portrait of him Gittins' <Chess Bouquet (1897)> p117: https://books.google.com/books?id=5... Would be nice to get a clipping of that on <CG> one way or the other. |
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Mar-31-23 | | stone free or die: RE: <Riddle>
OK, let me rephrase it then, copying this excerpt from the link shown previously: <Miss F.F. Beechey has assumed control of the chess column in the Sheffield Independent, formerly conducted by Bird.Mr. T.R. Rowland, of Dublin, has started a chess column in the Irish Sportman.> 1884.02.04 - Daily American (Nashville TN) - p?
Both editors published this game. What else did they (eventually) have in common? |
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Mar-31-23
 | | Sally Simpson: The first problem in the link to the Leeds Mercury W Grimshaw vs Steinitz, 1876 (kibitz #205) was composed by Joseph Babson he of the Babson Task; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Babso... |
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Apr-01-23 | | stone free or die: <RE: Riddle>
Might as well answer this one now. The two columnists, of the <Irish Sportsman> and <Sheffield Independent> went on to marry each other: F.F. Beechey-Rowland also wrote <Chess Blossoms>, which I was going to weave into the riddle, but I was already nerded-out enough as it was. Here's a nice article on F.F., with some choice photographs: https://www.chess.com/blog/introubl... Wonder if the Grimshaw--Steinitz controversy was responsible for them getting together?!? They married in June 1884 soon after she took over the column! . |
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Mar-29-25
 | | GrahamClayton: "In 1884, what purported to be the score of a 17-move game in which Grimshaw defeated Steinitz was published in the Illustrated London News, though it was asserted that it was played in 1880. Steinitz denied the authenticity of the published game, sparking sometimes-acrimonious debate in the chess press. James White commented briefly on the publication of this game, in his column in the Leeds Mercury Weekly Supplement of 26/07/1884, at the end of a section titled “FOREIGN”, as follows: We lately saw a game published in one of our chess columns at home represented as being played in 1880 between Herr Steinitz and Mr. Grimshaw, the English problemist. The game has just been shown to Herr Steinitz in America, who says such a game was never played, and further stated he has not seen Mr. Grimshaw for nine years. Captain Mackenzie drew Steinitz’s attention to the game. A week later, in the Leeds Mercury Weekly Supplement of 02/08/1884, an explanatory letter from Walter Grimshaw himself was published, seemingly in response to previous week’s comments. The quoted date of Grimshaw’s letter was 25/07/1884, the day before the publication date of the piece he was commenting on! Either White had sent Grimshaw an advance copy of what he proposed to publish, or else “25” is a misreading of “28” or, more probably, “29”. The piece including Grimshaw’s letter was as follows: EXPLANATORY. – In reference to the remarks we made last week on the subject of the game between Mr. Grimshaw and Herr Steinitz, we have received the following letter of explanation from Mr. Grimshaw, which we publish with pleasure, hoping some of our American exchanges will copy the remarks and give them the same publicity as was given the previous statement: - Whitby, July 25th [sic, 29th?]
Dear Sir, - Your paragraph in last Saturday’s Weekly Supplement respecting a game I played with Steinitz (which, I presume, was taken from an American paper) omits to state that Steinitz told Captain Mackenzie that he lost a game with Grimshaw about nine years ago. That statement is quite correct, as it was the only time I ever saw him or played with him. This game was played at the Divan in London. I won the game, but did not keep a record of it. A gentleman who was present it appears did so, and sent a copy of it to the Illustrated London News in 1880. The mistake seems to have been made by the American papers stating that it was played in 1880. If you refer to the Glasgow Herald or Detroit Free Press of nine years ago, you will find an account of our encounter and the amusement it caused at the time. “Mars,” in the Sporting and Dramatic News for March 8th says he was present at the Divan, and saw the game played. I may say that I never expected to see the game in print, and was surprised to find that any one had taken the trouble to copy it; as for my part, I could not have recollected the moves. – I am yours &c. W. GRIMSHAW." https://mannchess.org.uk/Games/1879... |
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Mar-29-25
 | | jnpope: Already covered. See:
W Grimshaw vs Steinitz, 1876 (kibitz #114) |
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Mar-29-25 | | stone free or die: (I was in on some of that. Funny, even though it was just one year ago I barely remember it) |
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Sep-08-25
 | | mifralu: W Grimshaw vs Steinitz, 1876 (kibitz #119)
<jnpope: I could not find the game published in the <Illustrated Sporting and Dramatic News>,> The score was published on page 211 of the Illustrated Sporting and Dramatic News, 10 November 1883, with no mention of Grimshaw or Steinitz. <CHESS AT SIMPSON'S DIVAN. A game played, December 30th, 1870, in which a great master was worsted by a tyro. White (Tyro.) Black (G. M.)
[...] For the gratification of the curious, it may be mentioned that the above game was recorded at the time by one of the spectators, who forwarded it to me for publication more than seven years ago.> |
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Sep-08-25
 | | jnpope: <mifralu>, nice find. I recently found the version published in the <Irish Sportsman> too! Perhaps I need to whip up a collections page on this game and consolidate the publication history/controversy of this game in a timeline format. |
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Sep-08-25
 | | jnpope: So Black is given as "G. M." which makes one wonder if this was actually played by the "great master" George MacDonnell himself!! |
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Sep-08-25 | | Chessist: G. M. = Great Master, but not George MacDonnell. |
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Sep-08-25
 | | jnpope: I just found it interesting that MacDonnell published it using "Great Master" which he thought of himself as being, and "G. M." also being his initials. Here's something else of interest:
<Will H. Lyons.—You having erroneously stated in last month's "Southern Trade Gazette" that Mr M'Donnell published the Grimshaw v. Steinitz game, we would be pleased if you corrected yourself.>
<Irish Sportsman Newspaper>, 1884.10.11, p653 Seems odd the columnist of the <Irish Sportsman> would demand an apology from Lyons for being truthful. |
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Sep-08-25 | | stone free or die: Does "tyro" = "beginner, novice" here? |
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Sep-08-25
 | | jnpope: <A game played, December 30th, 1870...>
Which would also push this game back six years before Steinitz met Grimshaw at the Divan (as reported by the <Detroit Free Press>, 1876.11.12, p6
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Sep-08-25 | | stone free or die: tyro from tiro (Latin) = new recruit or young soldier. |
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Sep-09-25
 | | jnpope: Here is a chronological transcription of the Grimshaw versus Steinitz materials: Game Collection: Grimshaw versus Steinitz.
Still wanting the actual articles published in the <Baltimore Sunday News> and the <Southern Trade Gazette>. I have yet to transcribe the relevant texts from the <International Chess Magazine> (1891).
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