I will be debuting Olga 2.0 to viewers of my live stream on twitch! <https://twitch.tv/TopherTech>

Tune in tomorrow (see time conversions below):

Eugene, USA Wed, Oct 7, 2020 at 6:00 pm PDT

London, United Kingdom Thu, Oct 8, 2020 at 2:00 am BST

Rio de Janeiro, Brazil Wed, Oct 7, 2020 at 10:00 pm BRT

Moscow, Russia Thu, Oct 8, 2020 at 4:00 am MSK

Toronto, Canada Wed, Oct 7, 2020 at 9:00 pm EDT

Corresponding UTC Thu, Oct 8, 2020 at 01:00

I will post more information after the stream for those members that cannot tune in.

Olga viewer used to work fine on our ipad until mid-September, but since then does not: the page is blank. pgn4web is ok but not convenient.

We cannot download flash player on the ipad, we would need to change web browser which is complex. The issue is with both Safari and Chrome.

I sent a mail to the helpdesk but without feedback (maybe because I am not a premium member?).

2.) Tap the JavaScript switch to turn on Switch On or off Switch Off.

Hello Teyss, I am like you just on the consumer side of things. Olga Viewer (account) is in full charge.

Maybe the present cue for tickets is higher as normal so it takes longer for all members alike. You are fine with an normal account.

You can check JavaScript afterwards e.g. here
https://www.whatismybrowser.com/det...

And my advice was indeed outdated as OV is right they have put a 'modern motor' in.

For possible other objects extending your browser's loading time a site like https://www.drlinkcheck.com/
could be interesting.

For me here in EU normal players' pages or even the homepage can take up to 15-25 sec. now (since a couple of months) on differrent up to date browser engines (+addons).

Fingers crossed it works out for you guys and you can enjoy all the games soon again.

<@ login> Many thanks, it's very friendly to answer (it does look like a friendly site). JavaScript is ok. I tried drlink, gives me issues but no clue what to do with it: 404 Not found 8, 403 Forbidden 2, Timeout 2, Host not found 1.

Teyss, (in our case) such scanners are used as a 'passive filter' for listing causes of 'delay' (you could block particular objects). So far the 'mid-Sept' clue holds the answer (setup and/or site changes) IMO. You said switching browsers is not available on your iPad, but do you see a chance 'adding' (not as replacement, for testing) one of the free alternatives given at https://www.lifewire.com/best-web-b...? If an installation is not prohibited by other factors.

OV, is there a reupload (the twitch channel has no vod) of the O 2.0 preview somewhere for us (non NA) plebs who missed it live? That posted preview gif looked smooth as a Zamboni. Merci.

< @ Teyss> Better yet, try a new PGN Viewer all together - https://protozefoss.github.io/

This is a preview of an early build of Olga 2. Details on how it works on your iPad would be very helpful! :) Big release coming the during the next stream!

Here is some feedback. I also checked on the computer, apparently it's the same.

Re. design, I like the fact we can adjust the size of the board vs score, as well as the colouring of the moves when clicking through them. However, it is a bit difficult to follow the score with all the notes inserted (maybe it's just a matter of habit). BTW, not sure why some moves are surrounded by dotted lines. Last, I hope the default colours are not final ;-) (light blue and purple).

Re. functionalities, what does not seem to work yet:

* The 3 middle icons in the penultimate line (square with bar, -, +) are frozen

* In the settings, General and Game score are blank, Keymap looks incomplete

* There is no engine, maybe it will come later on

* Pieces on the board can not always be moved (handy to analyse a variant) and when it's possible, illegal moves are allowed (e.g. one side moving multiple pieces)

<@ Teyss> Great, thanks for the confirmation!

"Re. design, I like the fact we can adjust the size of the board vs score, as well as the colouring of the moves when clicking through them. However, it is a bit difficult to follow the score with all the notes inserted (maybe it's just a matter of habit). BTW, not sure why some moves are surrounded by dotted lines. Last, I hope the default colours are not final ;-) (light blue and purple)."

<@ Teyss> Thank you for the feedback. All colors, sizes, fonts, and figurine notations, will be customizable to user's desire. No these will not be the default colors in the final release.

"Re. functionalities, what does not seem to work yet:

* The 3 middle icons in the penultimate line (square with bar, -, +) are frozen

* In the settings, General and Game score are blank, Keymap looks incomplete

* There is no engine, maybe it will come later on

* Pieces on the board can not always be moved (handy to analyse a variant) and when it's possible, illegal moves are allowed (e.g. one side moving multiple pieces)

Not sure it was what you were expecting. Apologies if not, else hope it helps. Cheers."

Topics:
- The design of the PGN "header"
- Design of floating "action buttons"
- Update on Olga and new features in public

https://www.twitch.tv/tophertech/sc...

Skipped through the VOD

- plus for the clear sound

- plus for keeping it lightweight
 (would sacrifice everything fancy for speed)

- plus for keeping it easily updatable
 (for future maintenance)

- plus for 'copying' good solutions from elsewhere

But most important 'it works' - you did a pretty good job there.

For the upcoming block about color themes viewers can try Lichess' free stuff (e.g. zen mode, menu implementation, dark board) in advance. Keep the bloopers coming and feel free to tell one or two unrelated crazy stories you experienced once. Do you believe in ghosts? Just have fun.

Ok guys, enjoy the next stream (a more lurid title 'Privet, more live coding making OLGA sexy today', check if you're still in the frame after a break, maybe add a bit of background music) and please upload a VOD again, thanks.

Thanks for such a lengthy and informative discourse.

A few observations:

It would be good to bear in mind that some game viewers (and book texts for that matter) fail because the analysis is barely distinguishable from the actual game moves. So please ensure that whatever the chosen fonts and font sizes, it is immediately obvious which is which, at a glance. Being able to easily follow the flow of the game moves is of paramount importance. Hopefully, your many selectable colour options will come in handy in this regard, but I do think that relative size and boldness have a major part to play as well, particularly for those who are colour blind of course.

On a related note, it would be helpful if in future VODs you could select a larger font size for the annotations/game score data, so that those of us with smaller sized monitors can read what appears in your demo.

Like you, I'm fond of the Deluxe Viewer 'Form-style', mainly because it resembles a score sheet that you would fill in at a tournament. This did introduce a lot of duplication though, given that the overall header contained largely the same information. I'm sure it would be better to clear space for something else rather than have the same info pointlessly repeated. Perhaps this was already your intention.

Could there be a puns on/off check box in settings? You are right that they're part of cg.com culture, and I wouldn't want to suggest that they get relegated in size or disappear completely, but there will be many who simply want to study chess without having this as a permanent distraction.

You mentioned the possibility of various external link options - how possible would it be to make the <player info box> part of a player's <wikipedia article> appear by right-clicking on his name, or similar?

I did want to ask two other questions though ...

The dotted boxes around some moves and blocks of analyses? What do they signify? They certainly make the score look incredibly busy and perhaps stand out more than anything else, but I couldn't work out what they were for.

<Boomie>: "I think a lot of the difficulty with Olga can be attributed to the attempt to make "one size fits all. To make a board that works for desktops and phones is probably impossible. There should be two types of Olga which people can select from the drop down list."

There definitely have been difficulties. A flexible layout system requires an intelligent design from the beginning. I absolutely disagree it is 'probably impossible'. Olga 1 does a fair job, and there was not a large effort to make it scale well to mobile; the main target audience at that time was still desktop computers. Olga 2 will do a fantastic job of this. But mostly because Olga 2 isn't about mobile vs desktop, it is really about choice. Want your game score on the left, not the right? You got it! Want the quick actions as buttons even if you have a keyboard? Sure! And OLGA 2 has even more sizing capabilities. We will still have a mobile/desktop styling so that users can "store" their settings on CG and have the correct setting applied depending on their device. You can avoid all of this, and just store your OLGA settings local to the device (using cookies).

<Boomie>: "I repeat my request to allow more than one line of analysis.....How are we supposed to analyze games if we can't try different lines at the same time? Do you really expect people to only use engines for analysis? What kind of mindless patzer would that create?"

Absolutely! One of the larger issues with Olga was only allowing one line of analysis. Olga 2 now supports something called `Recursive Annotation Variation`

<http://www.saremba.de/chessgml/stan...

The <dashed> boxes around the move represent that position has an available variation. Whether or not the boxes will be dashed, dotted, solid, or even exist is both a setting and a feature that we are currently discussing the design of. The question to the community - how should variations be displayed inline? a small marker at the start of the move? Does using the score item border seem logical to others (like it does to me)?

<Paint My Dragon>: "And am I right in thinking that the autoplay function comes with its own ticking down timer display? I like the idea that it can be set to a speed that is comfortable for the user, but I wouldn't want the distraction of a countdown of 'how many tenths of seconds until the next move displays'. I couldn't see any benefit in that, but maybe it's just there for beta testing purposes."

Interesting perspective. I thought the countdown timer was very useful for a couple of reasons -

1.) It communicates the current timer is running. I see how this might be distracting, but it also makes OLGA 2 feel "alive".

2.) Maybe instead of showing the running timer, it can just show the current autoplay delay. Then it would be less distracting but still, communicate the move delay currently set.

<Paint My Dragon>: "Could there be a puns on/off check box in settings? "

Lmao!

<Paint My Dragon>: "You mentioned the possibility of various external link options - how possible would it be to make the <player info box> part of a player's <wikipedia article> appear by right-clicking on his name, or similar?"

I think it would be possible but I'm not sure it would be "better". The reason a 'link' to the player page works, because the player page and content are not coupled to OLGA itself. The user goes to a separate page that is curated and developed on its own.

<Paint My Dragon>: "I'm wondering if part of your brief is to accommodate the Opening Explorer within Olga for an all-in-one experience? It would be preferable for the user, but as it is a premium member feature, i don't know how easy it would be to disable it for non-members, or whether it's simply too much work anyway."

I think OLGA 2 could improve lots of areas throughout CG. I am only developing OLGA but I think this is likely planned and will happen in time. The focus is on finishing OLGA 2 first of course.

<Login>: "Skipped through the VOD..."

And good luck. It sounds like there will be some substantial improvements over Olga 1.

I will be breaking up Wednesday streams into two separate videos.

The first video will focus on design elements and will be a more general discussion of Olga/PGN Viewers and life.

The second video will be focused on coding tasks and likely involve a more technical discussion of Olga.

First video starts at 7PM (PST) and the second video starts at about 8:10PM (PST) after a small break. Check the schedule for your local times
<https://www.twitch.tv/tophertech/sc...>

I would like to ask you to pin the link to the UI https://protozefoss.github.io/ here in your forum header and post it in the Kibitzer Cafe from time to time (if you like). The forum section of CG is a bit 'hidden' and most members will not check here too often.

Maybe with a small intro, so it will be easier to follow things for members who are late to the party. Also you could post the link 1x into twitch chat for the VODs.

For viewers:

Portable Game Notation Specification and Implementation Guide http://www.saremba.de/chessgml/stan...

Color Contrast
https://www.viget.com/articles/colo...

'I might be a weirdo', Topher gets a MTG pack starts unboxing.

So what is Magic?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSB...

Was the FEN stuck bec of the castling potion? Happy coding next time. Enjoy.

I will try to keep the videos more focused and likely shorter.

Anyone wanting to check out the past videos - Know they will start to disappear this coming Wednesday.