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|Apr-08-02|| ||refutor: As legend has it, the first Marshall gambit ever played. Frank Marshall saved this line up for a couple of years for Capablanca and got to unleash his devastating gambit (1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bb5 a6 4.Ba4 Nf6 5.O-O Be7 6.Re1 b5 7.Bb3 O-O 8.c3 d5!) on the man himself. Capablanca defended this sharp gambit correctly and won in fine fashion but playing over it again, I wonder if the debut of Marshall's gambit didn't deserve a better result for Black. |
|Apr-09-02|| ||refutor: Of course the modern Marshall gambit is 11. ...c6 instead of Marshall's 11. ... Nf6|
Possible improvements are 12. ... Bg4 and 13. ... Bb7 instead of the dubious 13. ... Ng4?!
Another possible idea would be 16. ... Nxh3+ 17.gxh3 Bxh3 with lots of open lines and lots of opportunity for white to go wrong, which admittedly is asking a lot v. capablanca :)
|Apr-09-02|| ||Doctor Who: Marshall had a fine attack working for him but somewhere he lost the thread of the game.|
(I had to do a double-take when I saw 15. ...Nxf2, but then I realized that 16. Qxf2 Bg3 and Black comes out on top.)
|Apr-09-02|| ||Sneaky: Rufutor, that 16. ... Nxh3+ 17.gxh3 Bxh3 line is fascinating. Was that your idea? I've attempted to analyze it a little bit. Here is my conclusion:|
If 18. Nd2 then Qg5+ is good
If 18. Be3? Bg4 19. Qf2 Bg3 and White can resign. (Ditto for 18. a4? and other pointless moves)
If 18. Bd2 Bg4 19. Qe4! and White might survive but I still prefer Black.
18. Bxf7+?! is strongly met, I think, with simply Kh8 (and not Rxf7? Qxa8+)
18. Rf2 Bh2+! 19. Kh1 (Rxh2?? Qe1+) Bg4 and White must brace himself for a nasty revealed check
That leaves one move... the best move, the one that Capablanca would see instantly: 18. Re4. I wish I could find a way to continue the attack after 18. Re4 but I think Black's hopes may fizzle out.
Conclusion: After 16. ... Nxh3+!? 17.gxh3 Bxh3 18. Re4! I think Black's attack fizzles out as he is practically forced to trade Queens.
|Apr-09-02|| ||refutor: i did think it up late last night, thinking that the king was so unprotected after 16. ... Nxh3+!? that it might be worth a try without giving it a second thought. 18.Re4! looks strong but I think that even after the exchange of queens, Black can still put up a fight and maybe a little more...those kingside pawns look strong to me. What do i know though? I'm just a patzer typing here :) |
|Nov-18-02|| ||refutor: Doctor Who... i don't know if you still frequent the site but in the women's olympiad, white tried 16.Qxf2 and ended up drawing...|
[Event "Olympiad w"]
[Site "Bled SLO"]
1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bb5 a6 4. Ba4 Nf6 5. O-O Be7 6. Re1 b5 7. Bb3 O-O 8.
c3 d5 9. exd5 Nxd5 10. Nxe5 Nxe5 11. Rxe5 Nf6 12. Re1 Bd6 13. h3 Ng4 14.
Qf3 Qh4 15. d4 Nxf2 16. Qxf2 Bh2+ 17. Kf1 Bg3 18. Qf3 Bxe1 19. Bf4 Bb7 20.
d5 Qe7 21. g3 b4 22. Na3 bxa3 23. Rxe1 Qd7 24. Qg4 Qxg4 25. hxg4 Rfe8 26.
Rb1 axb2 27. Rxb2 Re7 28. c4 a5 29. c5 Ba6+ 30. Kf2 Rae8 31. Bd1 g5 32.
Bxg5 Re5 33. Bf6 Rxd5 34. Ba4 Rf8 35. Rc2 h6 36. Bb3 Rd7 37. Kf3 Kh7 38.
Rh2 Kg6 39. Be5 f6 40. Bf4 Rh8 41. Rc2 Re7 42. Bd5 Rhe8 43. Rh2 Be2+ 44.
Kf2 Bxg4 45. Rxh6+ Kf5 46. Bc4 Rd8 47. Be3 Ke5 48. Rh4 Kf5 49. Rh6 Re4 50.
Bb3 Bd1 51. Bf7 Ra4 52. Rh1 Bg4 53. Bb3 Rb4 54. Re1 Kg6 55. Bf4 Rd7 56. Rh1
a4 57. Bc2+ f5 58. Rb1 Rxb1 59. Bxb1 Bd1 60. Ke1 Kf6 61. a3 Bb3 62. Bd2 Ke5
63. Bc3+ Ke6 64. Bd2 Rd5 65. Ke2 Bc4+ 66. Ke3 Rxc5 67. Kf4 Rd5 68. Bc3 Bb3
69. Kg5 Rc5 70. Bb4 Rb5 71. Bc3 Rd5 72. Kf4 Rc5 73. Bd2 Rc4+ 74. Kf3 Ke5
75. Bf4+ Rxf4+ 76. gxf4+ Ke6 77. Ke3 c5 78. Kd3 Bd5 79. Kc3 Be4 80. Ba2+
Bd5 81. Bb1 Be4 82. Ba2+ Bd5 83. Bb1 Bb3 84. Bd3 Kf6 85. Bb5 Kg6 86. Bd7
|Nov-19-02|| ||drukenknight: perhaps 16. ... Nxh3+!? 17.gxh3 Qg3+ exchanging queens immediately. |
|Nov-19-02|| ||refutor: i think that after 16 ... Nxh3+ 17.gxh3 black has sacced too much material to exchange the queens |
|Nov-19-02|| ||drukenknight: well up to that pt. material was even, then he sacks a N for 2 P essentially. So he's down in material, but white's K is totally exposed. |
sacrifices seem to abound what about 16...Ng4?
|Nov-20-02|| ||Honza Cervenka: Doctor Who, 16. Qxf2 Bg3?? is bad for 17.Qxf7+! with mate. Black has to play 16...Bh2+ and only after 17.Kf1 he can play 17...Bg3. |
|Dec-05-02|| ||refutor: in the main line after 16.Re2, "my" 16. ... Nxh3+ was tried in M Mora vs M Karff, 1950 |
|Dec-08-02|| ||pawntificator: 10. NxP --"I thought for a little while knowing that I would be subjected thereafter to a terrific attack, all the lines of which would be of necessity familiar to my adversary. The lust of battle, however, had been roused in me. I felt that my judgment and skill were being challenged by a player who had every reason to fear both (as shown by the records of our previous encounters), but who wanted to take advantage of the element of surprise and the fact of my being unfamiliar with a thing to which he had devoted many a night of toil and hard work. I considered the position then and decided that I was, in honor, bound, so to speak, to take the Pawn and accept the challenge, as my knowledge and judgment told me that my position should then be defensible." -Capa |
|Dec-08-02|| ||a99999: May want to be careful with your 16. Qxf2 Bg3 ... leads to black's being mated in 2 (17. Qxf7 RxQ 18. Re8mate)|
RE: 04/09/02 Doctor Who: I had to do a double-take when I saw 15. ...Nxf2, but then I realized that 16. Qxf2 Bg3 and Black comes out on top.
|Dec-10-02|| ||Kulla Tierchen: I was very impressed when as a boy I read, "Marshall waited years for the opportunity to spring his deadly surprise attack on Capablanca, but the wily Cuban refuted it over the board!" |
|Dec-10-02|| ||Sneaky: Honza wrote something brilliant that I just now figured out (I had a case of chess blindness) <Black has to play 16...Bh2+ and only after 17.Kf1 he can play 17...Bg3>|
For those of you who missed this let me paraphrase; After 15.Nf2 Qxf2 16.Bh2+! Kf1 17.Bg3 Qxf7+?? it's not mate in two because it's 18.Rxf7 *CHECK* Good one!
|Dec-10-02|| ||ongyj: I remember when I encounter this heroic game when I just began playing chess, I've always wondered whether this marshall's counterattack gambit can be declined with 10.d4? Anyone with ideas or comments on this? |
|Dec-10-02|| ||Sabatini: JR Capablanca is the all time chess genius. |
|Dec-10-02|| ||mdorothy: Definatly shows true chess genius against a prepared line, and how absolutely thurough planning cannot take the place of tactics, and pure skill. |
|Mar-13-03|| ||Green Bishop: After all the knight could be taken on move 14!
14. hxg4, Qh4 15. Qf3, Qh2+ 16. Kf1, Bxg4 17. Qxg4, Qh1+ 18. Ke2, Rae8+ 19. Be6, Rxe6+ 20. Qxe6, Qh5+ 21. g4 winning.
|Aug-06-03|| ||PinkPanther: Marshall managed to botch this game in the ending, I mean god forbid he tries to stop Capablanca from queening his b pawn. |
|Aug-06-03|| ||Calli: The whole legend about Marshall saving this opening for years is false. One book even claimed he was saving since the 1909 match. There is no evidence that Marshall found this gambit more than some few months before. Its a silly rumor anyway. Marshall played Capa many times in the decade leading up to this game. There was no reason to save it for New York 1918. It was not a special occasion or a big world class event. |
|Aug-07-03|| ||uponthehill: Could anyone tell me why Capablanca played 21.Bd2 instead of 21.Kxf2? |
|Aug-07-03|| ||Honza Cervenka: <uponthehill> Do you like white's position after 21.Kxf2 Qxc1? I think that 21.Bd2 is much better. |
|Aug-07-03|| ||Calli: Because of Qxc1. He can't let black invade the queenside. 21.Kxf2? Qxc1 22.Qe2 (the only move to guard b2) Qf4+ 23.Kg1 Rae8 24.Qf1 Qe3+ etc is at least equal. |
|Aug-08-03|| ||Cyphelium: Calli> A cautious assessment. =) I think your variation looks very good for black: After 21. Kxf2 Qxc1 22. Qe2 Qf4+ 23. Kg1 Rae8 24. Qf1 Qe3+ and now|
A/ 25. Kh2 Re6 26. Bxe6 fxe6 27. Qd1 (27. Qg1 Qh6+ 28. Kg3 Qf4 ) 27. -Rf6
B/ 25. Qf2 Qc1+ 26. Kh2 Re6 etc.
On the other hand, maybe 23. Qf3 is more stubborn?
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 1 OF 8 ·