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Viswanathan Anand vs Boris Gelfand
Anand - Gelfand World Chess Championship (2012)  ·  Sicilian Defense: Nezhmetdinov-Rossolimo Attack (B30)  ·  1-0
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Kibitzer's Corner
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 11 OF 11 ·  Later Kibitzing>
May-30-12  cormier: white king was always centralised
May-30-12
Premium Chessgames Member
  Jimfromprovidence: Im interested in finding out what the losing move was. I know 71...Rf5 was bad.

I'm looking for discussion over the merits of 72Kd7 vs. the text 72Kc8. The reason I bring this up is because Im seeing 73 Nd4 Bh5 following 72Kd7, below. (Black can not play 73...Bh5 in the text continuation).


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White cannot accept this exchange and can play 74 Rg7+ forcing 74Rf7. But white again has another threat in 75 Rg5.


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I think black is stuck here. If he plays 75Rf4 white can now exchange pieces with a won ending. If he plays 75Rh7 white can push his b pawn. 75Bd1 also looks lost.

My conclusion is that there is no difference in the outcome if black plays 72...Kd7.

May-30-12
Premium Chessgames Member
  sreeskamp: rapids and blitz are a world championship unworhty
May-30-12
Premium Chessgames Member
  HeMateMe: I would prefer it were one classical game per day, as a sudden death tie break. If the venue is already booked for something else, then you let them play in the one of the hotel conference rooms, under the eye of FIDE arbiters, with no audience present. If this isn't feasable, you move the match tie breaker to a nearby college, where there is a large hall or conference room available for a few days.

But--let the match be decided by classical time controls. Such a lack of common sense by those who set up a match. Chess doesnt need an audience or a battery of video monitors--it only needs a large, quiet room, with FIDE representatives present.

May-30-12
Premium Chessgames Member
  HeMateMe: I would prefer it were one classical game per day, as a sudden death tie break. If the venue is already booked for something else, then you let them play in the one of the hotel conference rooms, under the eye of FIDE arbiters, with no audience present. If this isn't feasable, you move the match tie breaker to a nearby college, where there is a large hall or conference room available for a few days.

But--let the match be decided by classical time controls. Such a lack of common sense by those who set up a match. Chess doesnt need an audience or a battery of video monitors--it only needs a large, quiet room, with FIDE representatives present.

May-30-12  awz16: I agree with badmojo. I doubt Boris will have any complaints when he has had time to truly reflect on this match. He will be disappointed in himself no doubt, but will not be bitter over anything. Gelfand is clearly not as efficient of a thinker as Anand and it showed. I don't see a tragedy here as far as this specific match is concerned. Had Boris had 2 mins remaining at move 69 and found a draw, that would have been the real tragedy. If he was as much of an endgame master as Svidler claimed, it would never ever have occured to him to play 70...Kd8 71.Ka5 Rf5 under severe time pressure or not. 71...Rf5 was an instant loss as it transposes to Lucena.

By whatever sequence the match was destined to finish, the more talented chess player won and I hope all will be be content with this. Hopefully this match did it's part to eventually kill off the classical chess championship.

May-30-12
Premium Chessgames Member
  Eyal: <Jimfromprovidence: I'm interested in finding out what the losing move was.>

Well, 71...Rf5 loses by force and, according to the official site, <71...Bh1!> is a draw according to "7-man Lomonosov tablebases" (http://moscow2012.fide.com/en/live?...). Can't argue with that... But moves 69-70, which move the king away from the queening square of the b-pawn and so prevent possibilities of getting a Philidor position in rook endgames, already make Black's situation very difficult in practical terms. Instead of the panicky 70...Kd8, for example, Kb8 seems to be holding after e.g. 71.b6 Bb7 72.Rg8+ Bc8 73.Kb5 Rf5! (73...Rh7? 74.b7 Rxb7+ 75.Nxb7 Kxb7 76.Rg7+ Kb8 77.Kb6) with the idea 74.b7 Rxc5+ 75.Kxc5 Kxb7. It's easy to understand, however, why the prospect of dealing with such mating threats wouldn't be appealing to someone who is playing with only a few seconds left on his clock.

May-30-12  maelith: <HeMateMe: I would prefer it were one classical game per day, as a sudden death tie break. If the venue is already booked for >

Yup, rapid and blitz tie breaker should be eliminated in this world chess championship(classical)and candidates matches..

May-30-12
Premium Chessgames Member
  thegoodanarchist: I stand firmly for the champion getting draw odds in the classical chess championship, so justice has prevailed!
May-30-12  Hesam7: <Well, 71...Rf5 loses by force and, according to the official site, <71...Bh1!> is a draw according to "7-man Lomonosov tablebases">

We have 7 piece tablebases now? This is fantastic!

May-31-12  QueentakesKing: Q---Why did Boris lose?
A---Bec. he is fat and overweight.
May-31-12  QueentakesKing: Q---Why is Boris fat and overweight?
A---Bec. he eats too much TIME!
LOL:-D
May-31-12
Premium Chessgames Member
  PhilFeeley: How does Anand win here? On time? It seems that black can hold the draw on move repetition. The computer on Chessbomb.com doesn't show a win. Can anyone demonstrate it?
May-31-12  Rachit: <PhilFeeley> check this link to see how the the position is lost http://www.chessbase.com/newsdetail...
May-31-12
Premium Chessgames Member
  Eyal: <Hesam7: We have 7 piece tablebases now? This is fantastic!>

As far as I know this is part of work in progress that goes on at the Lomonosov Moscow state university, but it's not fully ready yet...

May-31-12
Premium Chessgames Member
  PhilFeeley: No wonder I didn't see it. It was many moves away:

77.Rb8 Rb1 78.Ka7 Ra1+ 79.Kb7 Rb1 80.b6 Rb2 81.Rh8 Rb1 82.Ka7 Ra1+ 83.Kb8 Rb1 84.b7 Ra1 85.Rh4 Ra2 86.Rd4+ Ke7 87.Kc7 Rc2+ 88.Kb6 Rb2+ 89.Kc6 Rc2+ 90.Kb5 Rb2+ 91.Rb4 1-0

Gelfand had several drawing chances, including: 58...Bd3 and 71...Bh1

May-31-12
Premium Chessgames Member
  Eyal: <It was many moves away:

77.Rb8 Rb1 78.Ka7 Ra1+ 79.Kb7 Rb1 80.b6 Rb2 81.Rh8 Rb1 82.Ka7 Ra1+ 83.Kb8 Rb1 84.b7 Ra1 85.Rh4 Ra2 86.Rd4+ Ke7 87.Kc7 Rc2+ 88.Kb6 Rb2+ 89.Kc6 Rc2+ 90.Kb5 Rb2+ 91.Rb4 1-0>

Yes, but it's worth repeating that for anyone who is well familiar with the "Lucena Position" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucena...), one of the most basic and important in rook endgames, one look at the final position should make it clear that White is winning. The line given above illustrates the classic winning method of "building a bridge" on the 4th rank.

May-31-12
Premium Chessgames Member
  Jimfromprovidence: <Eyal> <Well, 71...Rf5 loses by force and, according to the official site, <71...Bh1!> is a draw according to "7-man Lomonosov tablebases">

Thanks. I concluded that 71....Rf5 was losing as well, but I was curious about 72...Kd7 being a possible saving alternative.

Did they conclude that 71...Bh1 was the only saving move, as 71...Ra7+ looks strong as well?


click for larger view

May-31-12
Premium Chessgames Member
  AylerKupp: <Hessam7> Here is some more information about 7-man Lomonosov tablebases (scroll down some).

http://rybkaforum.net/cgi-bin/rybka...

Don't hold your breath.

May-31-12
Premium Chessgames Member
  Eyal: <Jimfromprovidence: Did they conclude that 71...Bh1 was the only saving move, as 71...Ra7+ looks strong as well?>

If you look at the link that I gave, you can see that they only mention Bh1, and that without any analysis - just on the authority of some mysterious tablebase... (it's a bit funny that Gilberto Milos, in his analysis at the chessbase report, also mentions this move without any further elaboration as if it's supposed to be obvious - he probably took it from there). As for 71...Ra7+, my impression is also that it holds, but I won't be terribly surprise if it doesn't either, because overall Black's position looks shaky by this stage.

Jun-02-12
Premium Chessgames Member
  harrylime: This whole match just has to go down as the worst in world championship chess history.
Jun-03-12  Rachit: <This whole match just has to go down as the worst in world championship chess history.> how many have you seeen???
Jun-04-12  LIFE Master AJ: <<Jun-02-12 harrylime: This whole match just has to go down as the worst in world championship chess history.>>

A lot of people have said this, or something like it.

I think its sad. Its like people today cannot understand chess and make no effort to do so, the only thing that they understand is bloodshed. (And decisive games.)

It was a match played at a very high level. A lot of experts predicted a blow-out ... and they were dead wrong!!!!!

Aug-15-12  guyhaw: MB brought my attention to the longer resistance of 72. Kd7!? 73. Nd4! Bh5 74. Rg7+! Rf7 75. Rg5! (75. Rxf7? Bxf7 =) Bd1 76. b6 1-0.

I don't know the DTC or DTM for the position 76b here. I don't think b8=Q takes long.

Oct-19-14  1971: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rK96... This game's broadcast.
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