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| Jul-25-12 | | SamAtoms1980: "It used to be said that when Marshall made the famous twenty-third move, the chess board was showered with gold pieces. It should have been, but the story is apocryphal. Chess audiences do <not> have pieces of gold to throw away. But nevertheless that move was legendary" --- Harold C. Schonberg, <Grandmasters of Chess> (1981) |
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| Jul-25-12 | | Abdel Irada: <An Englishman>:
Although of course we're paraphrasing "Antony and Cleopatra" in any case, it seems to me that you're missing a "custom." |
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| Jul-25-12 | | Abdel Irada: <Once>:
I rather agree: 23. ...♕g3, while spectacular to look at, is a bit meretricious. It would be more just for us to reserve our highest accolades for moves of precisely the opposite kind: modest, unprepossessing moves on which world-shaking games turn and championships are built. But we are visual creatures, and the artistry that most readily stirs us is that which the eye can apprehend. By that measure, the move merits celebration. And there you have it: not the greatest move of all time, not even necessarily the best move in the position, and far from the only way to win this already won game. But in terms of sheer visual fascination, it's hard to top. |
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| Jul-25-12 | | Howard: Andy Soltis stated in one of his Chess Life columns from about twenty years ago that actually the spectators were paying off some type of bet---hence, the gold coins ! In other words, the brilliant move that Marshall played apparently had nothing to do with the gold coins being "showered". Frankly, this just sounds like not just an overrated chess move, but also another exaggerated chess story. |
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| Jul-25-12 | | Petrosianic: Soltis isn't the only one who said that, and it does look like that's the truth of the matter. Marshall always insisted that it was true, and it sounds like it was, just not in the way it sounds. But I don't think the move is particularly gaudy or "meretricious". Wild position like this, with everything hanging, are very easy to let get away from you. If you can find a way to bring it to a short, sharp end, do it. The move is not really overrated, it's just that Gold Coin story that makes it seem that way. |
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| Jul-25-12 | | kevin86: White is in a trilemma:three choices:all bad.
CHOICE 1:rook pawn takes=immediate mate
C2:bishop pawn takes=mate in two
C3 queen takes=loss of a piece and a lost game.
Happy Anniversary GPG! |
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| Jul-25-12 | | Petrosianic: <C3 queen takes=loss of a piece and a lost game.> Well, not quite. The piece had already been lost previously. But QxQ, which is relatively best, allows Black to get the Queens off, snuffs out any possibility of white counterattack, and puts Black into a won endgame with no chances for White. If you want to find fault with the move, that's the argument. That it doesn't smash through and mate, it's a consolidation move (as if that's a bad thing). |
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Jul-25-12
 | | tpstar: <Centennial Celebration> Great idea! Page 5 has an excerpt by Horowitz claiming that the gold coin story (however striking) is probably apocryphal. |
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| Jul-25-12 | | Petrosianic: Maybe, but Marshall always insisted that it really did happen. The gambling bets story makes the most sense. Marshall wasn't outright lying, he was simply misleading (they did throw the coins, but not for the reason you imagine). |
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| Jul-25-12 | | Chessmensch: Maybe this already appears on one of the earlier pages, but here is a good review of the situation. http://www.chesshistory.com/winter/... |
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| Jul-25-12 | | tivrfoa: Hi <Once>,
I agree with you if you can provide an alternative to 23. ... g3 that keeps black's material advantage.Thank you. |
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| Jul-25-12 | | The Last Straw: ...Qg3!!!! |
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| Jul-25-12 | | tivrfoa: Hi <Once>. Actually I agree with you, just would like to know if there's another move to keep the piece up. =) |
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| Jul-25-12 | | e4 resigns: I wonder how we can put this tactic in our own games... |
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| Jul-25-12 | | Girkassa: <tivrfoa>, at least there is 23...Qb2. White cannot play 24.gxh3 because of 24...Nf3+, and if 24.Rc7, then 24...Ne2+ 25.Kh1 Rh6 (now that the queen defends g7). Also, there is the more spectacular 23...Qe3. Anyway, happy 100th anniversary to 23...Qg3. Not the greatest move ever, but an aestetic way to finish the game. |
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| Jul-25-12 | | benjaminpugh: My own personal favorites for Best Move Ever are Fisher's 17...Be6 in The Game of the Century: D Byrne vs Fischer, 1956 and Morphy's 17...Qxf3 against Louis Paulsen: Paulsen vs Morphy, 1857 Both are true queen sacrifices with no immediate mate but lead to deep positional advantages with the minor pieces. |
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| Jul-25-12 | | tivrfoa: ouch. sorry... thank you <Girkassa> I forgot about the fork with Nf3 |
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| Jul-25-12 | | DanielBryant: I agree with <Once>. This is another reason why I've never been as impressed by the Opera game; because White could also have won fairly easily with Bxf7+ and Qxb7 early on in that. It's still a neat finish, though. |
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| Jul-25-12 | | newzild: I personally do think it's the greatest move of all time, if only for the sheer "wow" factor of placing a queen en prise to two pawns. As for the comments saying that it "only" leads to the exchange of queens if White makes the best response, to me that adds to the quality of the move in that it meets strategic (exchanging pieces when material ahead) as well as tactical goals. |
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| Jul-25-12 | | DanielBryant: That's one of the great things about beauty; it's subjective and there can be different approaches to it. For example, this combination is one of my favorites of all time because it leads not to immediate mate but to an endgame with a better pawn structure, suggesting the opponent's slip was somewhat smaller. Tal vs Hecht, 1962 |
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| Jul-25-12 | | Llawdogg: 23 ... Qg3!! Marshall's Immortal Move! |
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Jul-26-12
 | | eternaloptimist: 23...♕g3!! is a brilliant move played by the great Frank Marshall & is a move that has stood the test of time as CG proclaimed a centennial celebration for it!! I had the privilege of going to the Marshall chess club in NYC in '95 & played in a tournament there. My brother left New Orleans & moved up there for a year to go to New York University & then moved back to New Orleans. I spent ~10 days in NYC & had a great time up there! |
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| Jul-26-12 | | Once: Alternatives to 29...Qg3? Qb4, Qb2, Qa3, Qe3. The knight fork (on f3) keeps the Rh3 safe. |
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Jul-26-12
 | | Phony Benoni: Perhaps 23...Qg3 can be discounted as unnecessary and not really all that brilliant or decisive. All I know is that if any of us had found it over the board, we would have felt like a shower of gold was falling on us. |
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Jul-26-12
 | | perfidious: As always, <Once>'s commentary on the denouement is balanced and reasonable. That said, I'm much amused at a number of other kibitzes which attempt to denigrate the whole conception, and agree with <Phony Benoni>'s summation in the second sentence. |
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