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Sep-06-11
 | | perfidious: <OCF> Wohlers was something-a potential adventure every time out. |
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Sep-06-11
 | | OhioChessFan: <All sorts of people started running up for autographs,> I can't stand that. On my worst day, I wouldn't ask anyone for an autorgraph in a public setting. |
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| Sep-06-11 | | Jim Bartle: I don't ask for autographs either, though I did as a teenager going to SF Warriors games. But back then the NBA wasn't so big time and you could find players hanging around outside the locker room before games. My favorite autograph was Wayne Embry of Cincinnati. He told us, "I'll sign if you tell me who I am." He was in warmups, no name or number. We knew, so he signed. |
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Sep-06-11
| | OhioChessFan: Until Ron Harper came along, Wayne Embry held a boatload of school records at Miami. Interesting and sad story about the two of them: http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index... |
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Sep-06-11
 | | Phony Benoni: Which reminds me--Fox Sports showed the Tigers game last Saturday, with some play-by-play guy and Mitch "Wild Thing" Williams as color commentator. I didn't think he was bad, particularly because he didn't mince opinions. For instance, he refuse to excuse a pitcher because of unearned runs. In his view, that just showed the pitcher wasn't doing his job in tough situations. I did find it funny when he kept talking about how he would "deliberately" walk hitters if he felt the guy in the ondeck circle was easier to get out. I found it hard to imagine the Mitch Williams I remember being that much in control. I turned the game off when the Tigers fell behind 8-1 and thunderstorms rolled in, being the type who turns off appliances in that situation. After a nap, I got up and turned on the TV just in time to see the Tigers walking off with a 9-8 victory after scoring three in the ninth, climaxed by a Miguel Cabrera home run. I did catch some replays later. It was one of the more impressive "walk off" calls I've heard by a play-by-play guy: <"Gone. See ya. Game over. Wow."> http://detroit.tigers.mlb.com/mlb/g... There wasn't much else to be said. |
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| Sep-06-11 | | Jim Bartle: Really interesting story, OCF! Traded to the Clips, not good. And the Cavs didn't get much for Harper either, as it turned out. And Harper's attitude is interesting, too. He still seems to wish he had stayed in Cleveland, even though he landed as the point guard on some of the Bulls' championship teams. |
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Sep-06-11
| | OhioChessFan: I knew Harper in college a little. He was very shy and reserved. I worked with his cousin in the time he was in Chicago. She said he spent most his time in his apartment since he didn't like to go out much. I have a hard time believing the drug story myself. |
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Sep-06-11
 | | chancho: I remember that Ron Harper had a lisp, but I had no idea he had stuttering problems as well: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ElGk... |
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Sep-06-11
| | perfidious: <Phony Benoni> Just read the link to the August 1946 Eagle you provided elsewhere; I never knew the Soviet machine tried to control the playing conditions at the Groningen event. It was amusing to see that note on the Byrnes too.
I remember Edgar McCormick; one of the times I played the US Amateur Team event, our teams met, though Ed was third or fourth board for their side. |
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Sep-06-11
| | OhioChessFan: Yes, he stuttered. That was why he was so shy. He just avoided talking. |
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| Sep-06-11 | | Jim Bartle: If Harper was shy and stuttered, I wonder how he handled being Jordan's teammate. He was famously brutal toward the others on his team, tore them up in practice, etc. But maybe he was smart enough to see Harper wouldn't take it, or maybe Harper learned later in his career to handle it. He was certainly an excellent all-around player. I remember Sports Illustrated raving about him as a future pro when he was a senior at Miami. |
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| Sep-06-11 | | I play the Fred: <If Harper was shy and stuttered, I wonder how he handled being Jordan's teammate. He was famously brutal toward the others on his team, tore them up in practice, etc. But maybe he was smart enough to see Harper wouldn't take it, or maybe Harper learned later in his career to handle it.> My guess is that by that point in Ron Harper's career, Harper was as known as a known quantity gets, a smart, respected vet. IIRC, Jordan was a good deal more likely to ride the young players than he was the vets. I remember him riding Stacey King especially hard when King was in his first few seasons in the NBA. <When Stacey King entered the Bulls' practice facility one morning carrying a box, Jordan yelled, "I hope there's a jump shot in there"> - one example of many. This was one I remembered mostly verbatim. |
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| Sep-06-11 | | Jim Bartle: Rodney McCray is the one I remember. He was brought in to be a solid veteran backup, and Jordan supposedly just destroyed his confidence in practice with his play and trash talking. |
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Sep-07-11
| | chancho: Do you guys remember when Jordan went absolutely ballistic while Charles Oakley was being traded to the New York Knicks for Bill Cartwright?
(It was a very astute trade, since Cartwright's defense, shot blocking, and toughness was an integral part of that championship run of 91, 92, and 93. |
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| Sep-07-11 | | Jim Bartle: I think they would have won with Oakley as well; then they could have traded Horace Grant for a pretty good center. Speaking of Oakley, who were the greatest non-jumper players of all time? Oakley's up there, and Wes Unseld, and I think maybe (could be remembering wrong) Oscar Robertson. |
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Sep-07-11
| | perfidious: <chancho>: I'd forgotten that. In 1992, I went to a Bulls-Knicks game at Madison Square Garden with Cartwright manning the middle: http://basketballreference.com/team.... Poor game for #23, but Knicks were never really in it and got ground down. |
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| Sep-07-11 | | I play the Fred: <Speaking of Oakley, who were the greatest non-jumper players of all time? Oakley's up there, and Wes Unseld, and I think maybe (could be remembering wrong) Oscar Robertson.> I've made this point before, but Karl Malone elevated pretty poorly considering how big, fast, and strong he was. The vast majority of his dunks were of the one-hand off the one leg variety, taking off from no further than a few feet away. I've seen Larry Bird do two different dunks that were better than any I've seen Malone do. Of course, I'm of the opinion that athleticism is overrated in basketball, and many players excelled without standout athleticism. George Gervin was pretty slow and lean for an NBA player, but no one could guard him. |
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Sep-07-11
| | perfidious: <Fred> I remember Gervin as a great scorer; what enabled him to excel, lacking the size and/or speed? |
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| Sep-07-11 | | Jim Bartle: "what enabled him to excel, lacking the size and/or speed?" His impressive physique and bulk.
Gervin was deadly with a finger roll from up to ten feet. No other player I've seen has ever been good with it from beyond five feet. |
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Sep-07-11
| | perfidious: <Jim> Hard to imagine being good with that move beyond five feet at all, much less ten. He must have had arms longer than those of a gorilla. |
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| Sep-07-11 | | Jim Bartle: I remember around when the ABA teams joined the NBA, Sports Illustrated wrote that Gervin had all the skills and talent of Julius Erving, except he lacked the outright power. |
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| Sep-07-11 | | benjinathan: I have often thought that someone should make a movie about the nba season where gervin and david thompson came down to the wire in the scoring race:
thompson scored 73 points on the last day of the season, but gervin scored 63 to beat him. http://www.nba.com/history/features... The nba was wild and wooly back then |
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| Sep-07-11 | | Jim Bartle: The 1976-77 season was great, with the influx of all the ex-ABA stars and four teams. The champion Blazers featured three ABAers, including Maurice Lucas, and the losing finalist Philadelphia of course had Erving and a bunch of other ABA guys. Denver and San Antonio were great fun. Then, speaking of wild and woolly, there was Marvin Barnes. |
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| Sep-07-11 | | benjinathan: 1976 was the first year I started playing and then following basketball. That sixers squad was nuts and lots of echos in todays NBA: 33 Jim Barnett
14 Henry Bibby G
23 Joe Bryant F-
3 Fred Carter G-F 6-3
42 Harvey Catchings C-F 6-9
20 Doug Collins G-F 6-6 180
53 Darryl Dawkins C 6-11 251 January 11, 1957 1
10 Mike Dunleavy G 6-3 180 March 21,
6 Julius Erving F-G 6-6
21 World B. Free G 6-2
25 Terry Furlow G-F 6-4 190
11 Caldwell Jones C-F 6-11
30 George McGinnis
50 Steve Mix |
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Sep-07-11
| | perfidious: <benjinathan: ...thompson scored 73 points on the last day of the season, but gervin scored 63 to beat him...> How well I remember that final Sunday: I watched the NBA On CBS that day, though I really don't recall whether they had that Denver game on, but anyone who watched got an earful regarding Thompson's monster game. Kobe's father as a backup on that 1976 Sixers team: Henry Bibby, brother of Jim, who could pitch a little:
http://www.baseball-reference.com/p.... Then it's on to the guys on that crew who could play-they could win a title in today's league. |
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