< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 2 OF 2 ·
|Dec-07-07|| ||Sydro: The last move is so beautiful!|
|Dec-07-07|| ||playground player: Bird lost an awful lot of games using his own opening. He gets high marks for persistence.|
|Dec-07-07|| ||Riverbeast: <Bird was good player -with or without his "pion"s!>|
I disagree, I think Bird was a weakie. I've seen plenty of his games and I'm convinced he would be rated no higher than 2200 if he played today.
|Dec-07-07|| ||xrt999: <If (say) Kramnik or other super GMs played the Birds everyone else would be - it is a matter of fashion these openings.>|
I think the reason no one plays 1.f4 now is because it sucks!
In this example Bird is totally crushed in an embarassing fashion. I mean, black doesnt even bother to develop let alone move his queen's knight and bishop, just thrusting the king's pawns is enough to cave in Bird's joke of a kingside.
|Dec-07-07|| ||patzer2: The obstruction 17...Rf3! brings Bird's resistance to an end. White can choose between 18. Nxf3 Bxg3# or 18. Qxf3 gxf3 19. Nxf3 Bxg3# if he wishes to continue.|
|Dec-07-07|| ||al wazir: <gilbertblondy, xrt999>:|
If white had played 2. e4, transposing into a king's gambit, would that have sucked too? Wouldn't that "installer un pion au centre et contribuer au développement des pièces"? Do you think this position is an easy win for black?
|Dec-07-07|| ||PinnedPiece: <Mr. Bird and I played many games at this opening, and many
followed the same lines.>
Don't think many could have had Mr Blackburne using his pieces so efficiently as this!!!!!
|Dec-07-07|| ||parmetd: Blackburne missed mate on 17. Bxg3#!!
Anyways this game is an example of how terrible 1.f4 is and why every GM has commented that 1.f4 e5!! FORCES 2. e4 or black will win.
|Dec-07-07|| ||SuperPatzer77: <SJP: Masterful interference> I completely agree with you, SJP. It is a beautiful move - 17...Rf3!! - 18. Qxf3 gxf3, (below): |
19. Rd1 (only move) Bxg3+, 20. Kh1 fxg2+, 21. Nxg2 Bh3! (threatening Qxg2#), 22. Rg1 Bxg2+, 23. Rxg2 Qf1+, 24. Rg1 Qh3#. 0-1
19. Rg1 Qxg3+, 20. Kh1 Qh2#. 0-1
19. Rf1 Bxg3+, 20. Kh1 fxg2+, 21. Nxg2 Qxf1#. 0-1
After 21...Bh3!, the White Knight on g2 cannot retreat because of 22...Qh2#. White has no choice and has to defend the White Knight on g2 with 22. Rg1 by delaying Nc3. After 22. Rg1, Black's move: 22...Bxg2+, 23. Rxg2 Qf1+, 24. Rg1 Qh3#.
Instead of 18. Qxf3, 18. Rf1 Qxg3+!, 19. Kg1 Qh2#. 0-1
|Dec-07-07|| ||RookFile: <parmetd: Blackburne missed mate on 17. Bxg3#!! >|
Take another look at that queen on b3.
|Dec-07-07|| ||SuperPatzer77: <parmedt: Blackburne missed mate on 17. Bxg3#!!....> |
Blackburne actually didn't miss 17...Bxg3# because of 18. Qxg3 - You must've overlooked 18. Qxg3. If 17...Bxg3??? (blunder), then 18. Qxg3! and Black's attack is over. Blackburne's brilliant move is 17...Rf3!! Actually it is masterful interference.
|Dec-07-07|| ||parmetd: ah you are correct I was looking at the position with Rook already on f3 blocking the queen as black to move.|
|Dec-07-07|| ||ganstaman: 6. Qd3 and white is fine.
I think that Bird is a stronger opening than player.
<parmetd: Anyways this game is an example of how terrible 1.f4 is and why every GM has commented that 1.f4 e5!! FORCES 2. e4 or black will win.>
If you're serious, I'd be interested in seeing where even 1 GM said such a thing.
|Dec-07-07|| ||xrt999: < al wazir: <gilbertblondy, xrt999>:
If white had played 2. e4, transposing into a king's gambit>|
Blackburne employed psychological tactics: Blackburne knew that Bird would not likely play a move like 2.e4 in this opening, it was not stylistically within Bird's opening play. Bird played 1.f4 to play the system, not to transpose into the KG.
If you are playing someone skilled in the KG then you have a point: you dont want to play 1...e5. I personally either play 1...g6 or 1...d5 against 1.f4
Then again, I had a discussion with someone regarding the statistics of the KGA over the last 100 years a while back, overwhelmingly in favor of black; in the KGA black has a winning record and any other response by black other than 2...exd4 is winning for white.
So, that being said, either way, you either play a system against 1.f4 or transpose into the KGA, both winning records for black.
|Dec-07-07|| ||MorphysMojo: Blckburne absolutely owned Bird 25 - 7 over their playing history. Bird was known for eccentric openings that helped him beat weak British players frequently, but he got chewed up by the talented ones: 1.5 - 4.5 v. Paulson, 1 - 7 v. Zukertort, 1.5 - 8.5 v. Chigorin, 3.5 - 6.5 v Gunsberg and with an embarrassing record against both Steinitz and Lasker (as did many). To his favor Bird was 5 - 4 against Anderssen, and even in score with Janowski, but really Bird was one of the "lesser of the greats", known more for innovation and creativity than performance.|
|Dec-07-07|| ||xrt999: Bird vs Blackburne, 1895|
Bird, despite getting totally crushed here in 1886, tried 1.f4 and responded the same exact way to 1...e5 against Blackburne in 1895
|Dec-07-07|| ||RookFile: Players of the 19th century had an interesting stubborness with their openings: no matter how many times they got crushed with the same opening, because they believed in it, they were always coming back for more.|
|Dec-08-07|| ||Richard Taylor: <twin phoenix: My goodness all these games are so pretty! this one is awesome but the two mentioned by R Taylor and Pawn to QB4 are just as incredible. Thanks for posting these games cuz i truly enjoyed seeing them all!!!> |
The Lasker game is annotated in a book of his games I have - I think it is by Reinfeld.
I saw that game; and had a last round game to play v a player (he was from Germany and playing Chess on his holiday) I knew he played either the Birds or 1 e4 so I prepared the Froms but was concerned about him playing a King's Gambit as I didn't know that very well from the Black side - as it happened he played 1 e4! and I won when he went (very) wrong...and I thus won the tournament - but don't know how I would have gone if I had essayed the Froms as in a Blitz game I lost against his 1 f4! e5 2 e4..etc
But I was determined to go on the attack (it was do or die!) as I wanted to win tournament outright as I did!
I think I would always accept the King's Gambit.
|Dec-08-07|| ||Richard Taylor: <RookFile> Good point. But it doesn't mean their openings were no good - it sometimes means you need a break to work on the opening ideas.|
|Dec-08-07|| ||t3hPolak: <xrt999>Bird's doesnt suck, like every opening it requires some study and usage. Besides, I personally know someone who is amazing with Birds.|
So Bird used the opening and got crushed; who cares? Openings werent discovered perfect. They were flawed, refined by loss after loss, until they became a useful tool to add to the repetoire.
|Dec-08-07|| ||PinnedPiece: How would Bird play against 1.f4?
Blackburne vs Bird, 1892
|Jun-10-09|| ||Fanacas: No offence but if you take morphy tho this age he would suck in chess 2 ^^ compaered with the old master we learn form them ^^. And 1....e5 isent the best answer against 1.f4 lasker himself said it many other grandmaster said it 1....d5 is porbaly better.|
|Jul-01-10|| ||YoungEd: Blackburne: Undefeated champion of the lacaonic and generally unhelpful annotations!|
|Jan-19-11|| ||sfm: Cute! 4 white pieces can capture the rook, but...|
|Feb-03-13|| ||Cemoblanca: ...or "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest". ;)|
< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 2 OF 2 ·