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< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 3 OF 3 ·
Later Kibitzing> |
| Oct-05-12 | | PinnedPiece: Too much for me. I saw the pin with bishop on f6 but felt RxNd7 was stronger... bah.
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| Oct-05-12 | | agb2002: White has the bishop pair and a pawn for a bishop and a knight. Black threatens 35... Bf3+.
White can counterattack by pinning the rook with 35.Bf6: A) 35... Bf3+ 36.Bg2
A.1) 36... Bxg2+ 37.Kg1
A.1.a) 37... Qa6 38.Bxg7+ Kg8 (38... Kxg7 39.Rxd7+ and mate next) 39.Qd8+ and mate in two. A.1.b) 37... Nxf6 38.Qxf6 Qg8 39.Qxg7+ Qxg7 40.Rc8+ Qg8 41.Rxg8+ Kxg8 42.Kxg2 and while the black king tries to stop the a-pawn the white king captures the h-pawn, winning. A.1.c) 37... Qe8 38.Bxg7+ Kxg7 39.Kxg2 + - [R+P vs N]. A.2) 36... Qa6 37.Bxg7+ is similar to A.1.a.
A.3) 36... Nxf6 37.Qxf6 is similar to A.1.b.
A.4) 36... Qe8 37.Bxg7+ is similar to A.1.c.
B) 36... Nxf6 37.Qxf6 Qg8 38.Bc4 Bf7 39.Bxe6 Bxe6 40.Rxg7 Qxg7 41.Qxe6 with a won ending. For example, 41... Qg4 42.Qf6+ Kg8 43.Qg5+ creating a new passed pawn on the king side. C) 36... Qe8 37.Bxg7+ + - [R+P vs N]. |
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| Oct-05-12 | | agb2002: 38.Bc4 in my line B is a terrible blunder which allows 38... Bf3#, as mentioned by <JFP>. Can't believe I forgot it while typing my post. |
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| Oct-05-12 | | Marmot PFL: Black was 34...Bh5 was probably hoping white would fall for 35 Rxd7? Bf3+ 36 Bg2 Bxg2+ 37 Kg1 Qa6 but this is too easy for Dr. Saidy to miss. Saidy played in the first tournament I was in, way back in the 70s, and I think won it. Of course we were not in the same section, I played in the <1600 and got a plus score. If I had known he was coming I would have brought my copy of Battle of Chess Ideas for him to autograph. |
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| Oct-05-12 | | Marmot PFL: Not that black had anything better than 34...Bh5. He was losing this position strategically probably since move 20 or so when both his pawn structure and piece placement are worse. |
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| Oct-05-12 | | psmith: <phonybenoni> This is all assisted by Rybka 2.2 (full disclosure). And I didn't get the solution, having gone down the losing Rxd7 road. But anyway: First of all, in your line 35.Rxd7 Bf3+ 36.Bg2 Qa6 37. Qf2 Bxg2+ 38. Kg1 Bf3+ why can't White hold with 39. Rxg7? But 36...Qa6 is winning, only the correct followup is 37. Qf2 Rxg2 38. Bf6+ Kg8! (not 38.... Rg7+ 39. Qxf3 exf3 40. Rd8#) and now 39. Qxg2 is pretty much forced, and Black wins. But, after 35.Rxd7 Bf3+ 36.Bg2, 36...Qxa2 is even stronger than 36... Qa6 (leads to forced mate in 8 according to Rybka). |
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| Oct-05-12 | | kevin86: I went with the exchange sac,and missed the counter-attack power of black's bishop,rook,and queen. |
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Oct-05-12
 | | HeMateMe: Right in the 'ol bread brasket! |
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| Oct-05-12 | | psmith: <JimfromProvidence>
After 35 Bf6 Nxf6 36 Qxf6 Qg8 37. h4 Bf7 Rybka (2.2) finds something extremely clever. 38. d5! (stronger than the immediate Rd7 because the guard on the f5 pawn is weakened, the importance of which will become apparent shortly...) and now: 38... exd5 39. Rd7 h5 40. Rd8 Be8 41. Bh3 (the point! this is just about zugzwang) Kh7 (for example) 42. Bxf5+ Rg6 43. Qe5! and White mates by force according to Rybka. There are lots of other variations, but either they involve giving up the Queen for the Rook or getting mated or both. or... 38... h5 39. dxe6 Bxe6 40. Rxg7 Qxg7 41. Qxe6 and White is up a piece and will mop up the pawns as well. Black can't try something like 41... Qg4 because of 42. Qh6+ Kg8 43. Bc4#, so Black has no hope of a perpetual. |
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Oct-05-12
 | | Sneaky: It takes a lot of guts--or "chess heart" if you will--to play into a line where Black gets to play 35...Bf3+ then gets to take a bishop for free and THEN gets a revealed check on your king. The way my brain works, I think "revealed check on my king? NO WAY!" and the analysis goes no further. |
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| Oct-05-12 | | thegoldenband: <psmith: After 35 Bf6 Nxf6 36 Qxf6 Qg8 37. h4 Bf7 Rybka (2.2) finds something extremely clever.> What a nifty line! I'd like to think the strongest and most creative human players would be able to find it. |
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Oct-05-12
 | | chrisowen: Jarring abound queen hook it cleric too f6 poof goes the weasel (counterpart) one h5 im liking farside a fiend see bishopg2 only move to juxtapose round up capture i g2 nab in giving check king sidestep horse swipe at man you reference f6 inx d7 sussed queen have take back and mate is sure to follow i suppose yeah black can wriggle with qa8 low and belo-hold me the money it be in a6? B so loot in g7 and many checks on the way from in learn i cede an alternative in d7 f6 then dilemma relish Qxf6 qg8 37.h3 gives tid bit morsel in shake up ride white xtra pawn counts really (voodoo running from my magic) cad get to grips f6 f3+ in lodge it her b in g2 black bang to rights right off in g1 slide away it Qe8 in arrow h6 reticular net re dated off in cap i toil in tease ball DAS king g1 safe definate am in bode well fat chance in 35.Bf6 Nxf6 36.Qxf6 Qg8 37.h3 a puffin cuffed? |
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| Oct-05-12 | | Robespierre: Do I get 5% credit for getting white's first move, 35 Bf6, correct? And, possibly, another 5% for getting white's 2d move, 36 Bg2, correct? That's about all that I can honestly claim. |
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| Oct-05-12 | | Tiggler: 35.Rxd7 Rxd7 (otherwise black is just a piece down.
36.Qf6+ Kg8 (... Rg7 37.Qf8+ Rg8 Bf6#)
37.Qxe6+ Rf7 (otherwise 38.Qxd7)
38.Qe8+ Rf8 (otherwise B checks and the black Q is lost)
39.Bc4+ .... can't see all the rest, but I think it must win. |
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| Oct-05-12 | | Patriot: This does seem difficult. As a puzzle, 35.Rxd7 is just about the only candidate that looks like it could win. 35.Qxh5 Qxd8 does not look strong. 35.Rxd7 Rxd7 36.Qf6+ Kg8 (36...Rg7 37.Qf8+ Rg8 38.Bf6#) 37.Qxe6+ Rf7 38.Qe8+ Rf8 (38...Kg7 39.Bf6+ and 40.Qxa8  ) 39.Bc4+ Kg7 There are a number of choices here. 40.Qe5+, 40.Bf6+, 40.Qe7+, 40.Qd7+. I've already spent too much time on this. White gains the initiative and is probably winning. I'll go ahead and see what happened. |
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| Oct-05-12 | | zakkzheng: Bf6 Bf3+ Bg2 Bxg2 Kg1 Nxf6 Qxf6 Qg8 Rxg7 Qxg7 Qxg7 Kxg7 Kxg2 and white is up the pawn and should be able to win the ending with no tactical play. |
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| Oct-05-12 | | Patriot: Well I was right that white is winning in the lines above, but for some strange reason I never considered the obvious 35...Bf3+ which wins for black. Apparently I got tunnel vision. |
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| Oct-05-12 | | morfishine: <kellmano>
On your comment <Flash, but isn't 35 .....Bf3+ 36. Bg2 Qa6 better?> Sute is better....I guess once I saw the potential of <Qa6> I couldn't think straight at all |
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| Oct-05-12 | | benjaminpugh: As usual, Crafty comes up with a different defense, but it's ultimately a loss for black. After 37. Kg1, Crafty continues with 37...Nxf6. After that, I just traded off all the pieces to reach a winning endgame. 38. Qxf6, Qg8
39. Rxg7, Qxg7
40. Qxg7, Kxg7
41. Kxg2
Try for yourselves: http://www.chessvideos.tv/endgame-t... |
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| Oct-05-12 | | stst: Main line could start with
35.Rxd7 Rxd7
36.Qf6+ ...
IF (A)
36..... Rg7
37.Qf8+ Rg8
38.Bf6#
IF (B)
36...... Kg8
37.Qxe6+ Rf7
38.Bc4 b5
39.Qf8+ Kg7
40.Bf6+ Rxf6
41.Qxa8 bxc4 etc, Black lost its Q and the aP can advance freely. |
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Oct-05-12
 | | al wazir: <Phony Benoni: White can simply play trade the big pieces on g7, capture the bishop and go for a win with the help of the outside passed pawn.> Yes, I'm sure that's it. As bad as I am at endgames, I think I could win that one. |
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| Oct-05-12 | | jancotianno: Total mindblock on this one analysed many lines of 35. Rxd7 and believed it to be winning and completely missed 35... Bxf3+ with a win for black. |
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Oct-05-12
 | | Phony Benoni: <psmith> Thanks for the lines from Rybka. It's good to know my judgment was correct, if not my analysis. Which was the story of my chess career. |
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| Oct-06-12 | | TheBish: Saidy vs C Brasket, 1972 White to play (35.?) "Difficult", White is up a pawn. This one was difficult for me, although I saw the winning idea and dismissed it! The reason I dismissed it was because I didn't count the pawns to begin with! So in a key line (which I will discuss), I didn't see a clear continuation, but there is a way to simplify if you realize you're a pawn up! I think it might be easier to see if you are playing this game, because you would be well aware of the material count. Anyway... 35. Bf6! Bf3+
Probably the main line. I saw that White can play this, even giving away a piece for the attack. After 35. h3 Bf3+ 36. Kh2 Qxa2, White would only have a slight advantage. 36. Bg2 Bxg2+ 37. Kg1 Nxf6 38. Qxf6 Qg8
At first I thought White could play 39. Rd7 (threatening 40. Rd8), but Black plays 39...Bf3+ 40. Kf2 Bh5! and the bishop can interpose on e8 now. Then it hit me that White was up a pawn! 39. Rxg7! Qxg7 40. Qxg7+ Kxg7 41. Kxg2 and White is up a pawn and should win without a problem. |
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| Oct-06-12 | | Abdel Irada: <The perils of ambition> Only half-credit for me today, if that. I found the key move: <35. ♗f6<>>. But I missed the point: White need only trade off pieces to win. Instead, I tried for more and had to settle for a drawing line, as follows: <35. ...♗f3†
36. ♗g2, ♗xg2†
37. ♔g1, ♘xf6
38. ♕xf6, ♕g8<>> So far, so forced. But here is where some perverse ambition blinded me to the winning continuation. Instead, I carried on with <39. ♖d7?...>
With this move, I aimed for 40. ♖d8, pinning the queen. But Black has a saving resource: <39. ...♗f3†
40. ♔f2...>
Exchanging on g7 no longer works; Black is a piece ahead. <40. ...♗h5!
41. ♖d8, ♗e8
42. h4, h5>
Here I looked and looked for a finesse that would allow me to gain a tempo with queen checks on h6, alternating with reinstating the pin from f6, but it simply didn't exist. Therefore my line ended here, with a perpetual check. My only consolation: At least it didn't lose. ***
In retrospect, the winning line is so plain I can't imagine how I overlooked it. Following the preceding line through move 38, White need only deviate thus: <39. ♕xg7†, ♖xg7
40. ♖xg7, ♔xg7
41. ♔xg2 <>> And yes, the ending really is just that clear a win. With a strong potential outside passed pawn on a2, White need only run the a- and b-pawns until Black's king is forced to chase them down, and use the time gained to penetrate with his own king, pick off the pawn on e6, and promote his d-pawn. As <PinnedPiece> so eloquently expresses it: Bah! |
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< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 3 OF 3 ·
Later Kibitzing> |
Kibitzing
sac: 35.Bf6