< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 2 OF 2 ·
|Nov-19-08|| ||fref: The rook(and two pawns) beats the two knights. wow|
|Nov-19-08|| ||Marmot PFL: Adams must not be well as otherwise he would be a more solid choice to draw with black.|
|Nov-19-08|| ||shintaro go: Good game from Kramnik. Got an advantage in the Queenside but had to pull off some tactics in the end. Great deception in the end, which Short greedily took the seemingly free pawn, which leads to mate after Rh1.|
|Nov-19-08|| ||Jim Bartle: OK, so how would white have continued the attack after 39...Nxc5?|
|Nov-19-08|| ||shintaro go: <OK, so how would white have continued the attack after 39...Nc5?> Maybe 40.dxc5 then followed by Rh8+. Kramnik will probably try to exchange rooks by Rb8 then Rb7 and try to promote the strong 'a' passed pawn. I have no chess programs to back this up, but generally I think that's the main plan given the advantage in the Queenside|
|Nov-19-08|| ||Jim Bartle: I was thinking maybe following with c6 would leave the black king with no escape after a Rh8...|
|Nov-19-08|| ||shintaro go: I'm surprised Short allowed 20. Bxb5 which gives up bishop and knight for a rook and Queenside initiative.|
|Nov-19-08|| ||nescio: <shintaro go: I'm surprised Short allowed 20. Bxb5 which gives up bishop and knight for a rook and Queenside initiative.> How would you prevent it after 19.Nc3 ? White also threatens 20.Nxd5.|
|Nov-19-08|| ||VaselineTopLove: I don't think there's an immediate mate here, just a lost position.|
Because after 47.Rh1 there is 47...Nxc6
48.Ra1+ Na5 49.Rba2 and Black loses the Knight but can play some moves like 49...Rf7+ Kg2 Nd6 and eventually be R + 3P vs. Knight + 2P
|Nov-19-08|| ||dovif: Yeah Nigel came up Short in this one|
|Nov-20-08|| ||yalie: 29..c6 was a holdable option for Nige.|
|Nov-20-08|| ||Woody Wood Pusher: 17..b5 is one of the ugliest moves I have ever seen.|
|Nov-20-08|| ||GeauxCool: Did anyone else think about this endgame while this one was happening? Shirov vs Topalov, 2008 |
|Nov-20-08|| ||Eyal: From the Short page:
<PinnedPiece: Nigel feels the heat in the middle game with a half-open c-file for white. Black's pieces get tied up in the queen's corner, and never make it out.
Move 46..Kxa6 allowed immediate mate. Not much to be done in any case but 46..Rxc6 would certainly have gone further....
Nigel what happened? It seemed you had plenty of time on the clock....>
<Nigel Short: "What happened?" I played Black against someone 130 rating points higher than me - that is what.>
|Nov-20-08|| ||euripides: Short used to be an enthusiast for the black side of the QGD, particularly a line where black allows his kingside pawns to be smashed. Here he tries a similar structure to the exchange QGD but with a knight on c6. Probably Kramnik is as tough a person to test this against as anyone.|
|Nov-20-08|| ||euripides: Last time I remember Kramnik having a rook against two knight this happened: |
Kramnik vs Topalov, 2006
|Nov-20-08|| ||ozmikey: <Jim Bartle: OK, so how would white have continued the attack after 39...Nxc5?> I would think 40.Rh8+ Kd7 41.dxc5 is best. Black's rook and knight are immobilised (41...Nf5 42.b6, and Black will have to give up his rook for the pawn), and White can start marching his king in. Or am I missing something?|
|Nov-24-08|| ||acirce: ..b5 is a normal move that happened to run into a problem of tactical nature. But imagine if Black played 19..Nb6 and there were no 20.Nxb5. Then Black plays ..Nc4 the next move, blocking the c-file, and is perfectly fine. Highly thematic resource in this kind of position, and Kramnik must have seen in advance that it did not work.|
Even when White was up Rpp vs NN, though, I did not really understand at the time why it was so clear that he was much better. I followed part of the game live and was surprised that Rybka gave a basically winning eval for White. Seemed that Black could place his knight on good squares and still create some sort of blockade and still live. Was 29..c6 better, to stop b5 ?
The way Kramnik broke through and switched play to the kingside at the right moment was not spectacular, but instructive, a variation of the "two weaknesses" principle, "weakness" used in a broad sense. 34.h3 may have been my favourite move in the game - a quiet pawn move when it seemed like the action was taking place far from there. It probably still took a bit of non-trivial technique to win. The rook endgame that would have occurred after 46..Rxc6 47.Rb7+ and Rxe7 instead of 46..Kxa6?? must be winning for White, but perhaps it was not yet a 100% sure win.
|Nov-24-08|| ||Karpova: <acirce: The way Kramnik broke through and switched play to the kingside at the right moment was not spectacular, but instructive, a variation of the "two weaknesses" principle, "weakness" used in a broad sense. 34.h3 may have been my favourite move in the game - a quiet pawn move when it seemed like the action was taking place far from there.>|
Yes, that was very nice and reminded me a bit of Kasparov vs Grischuk, 2001
|Mar-05-09|| ||Eban: Kramnik's only victory in the Olympiad,
if only Nigel Short played the Tartakower QGD or something similar instead of this chigorin nonsense there would have been a better chance Kramnik would have remained winless!
|Mar-05-09|| ||Riverbeast: Morozevich used to play the Chigorin....
One of the ways top flight GMs stay ahead of their peers, is by taking an opening considered inferior by theory, and finding new wrinkles in it....
Okay, Short didn't exactly prove the point in this game, but I don't know if the opening was really the cause of this defeat
|Apr-27-09|| ||Andrijadj: I think opening is the direct reason for Nigel's loss in this game.Just look at the position before white's 13th move...Kramnik is calling all the shots in the queenside and Nigel has noting to counter it...|
|Aug-23-09|| ||Karpova: <Jim Bartle: OK, so how would white have continued the attack after 39...Nxc5?>|
Vladimir Kramnik: <39...Nc5 40.Rh8 Kd7 41.dc5 Ke6 42.Kd3 and White is winning>
Source: Sasa Velickovic's <The Ten Best Games of Chess Informant 104>
|Dec-24-09|| ||LaFreak III: Kramnik did his best to draw this game to keep his drawing streak, unfortunately he wins it. So sad for him.|
|May-28-12|| ||Tigranny: I guess that this game is a good example of how not to play the Chigorin Defense of the Queen's Gambit Declined.|
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