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| Oct-27-13 | | parisattack: Did not know of Chebanenko's analysis here...
...d5 was basically the first 'try' in the Lasker-Pilnik-Pelikan-Hunt-Sveshnikov-Chebanenko-
Sicilian. Then came ...Rc8 from Larsen then finally ...b5 - although Larsen played ...b5 in 1958 against Olafsson only to go to ...Rc8 in 1962 against Robatsch. It was the latter game that encouraged me to take up the variation shortly after Larsen's book of games came out in 1970. <SimonWebbsTiger> I assume you know of chesspublishing.com - good forums on openings there. Never much interest in openings here on CG. |
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| Oct-27-13 | | SimonWebbsTiger: @<parisattack>
yes indeed. Only so many hours in the day though when one keeps an eye on ideas in Informator, New in Chess Yearbook, Chessbase Magazine plus study Classic games and train, follow GM tourneys on-line and play/prepare in/for my own tourneys! :) |
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| Oct-27-13 | | parisattack: <..only so many hours in the day though...> Yup. Feel your pain on that score <SimonWebbsTiger>. My fantasy is to spend two years just on chess and one year on Go when I retire... just enough to scratch the surface, really. |
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| Mar-12-14 | | SpiritedReposte: Famous game where Fischer "refuted" Tigran's preparation. Who can fritz 17. ...e4!? Looks sharp. |
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| Apr-10-14 | | thegoodanarchist: Here Bobby Fischer establishes a mark that will never be broken: Twenty straight victories with no defeats and no draws against GM competition. In the WC cycle no less! The streak started with the Palma de Mallorca Interzonal Tournament. Players had to place well in their zonal tournaments just to be invited to the interzonal, where they faced a buzz saw never before seen in an IZT, and never since seen again. After concluding the tournament with 7 straight wins, Bobby proceeded to throw down a chess blitzkrieg on his next two candidates match opponents, winning 6-0 against Taimanov (a product of the Soviet Chess Machine) and then 6-0 again!!! against the world #3 ranked player, Larsen. And if you don't mind, he capped that with a win against former WC TVP (NOT textured vegetable protein, but Tigran V Petrosian!) to set the mark of 20 straight. Sure, Tigran took the next game, and drew 3 in a row after, but then Bobby dispatched him as if he were a punk with a brutal 4 straight wins, thrashing the former world's greatest as if he were a fish. The only thing to say is "wow wow wow" |
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Apr-11-14
 | | offramp: < thegoodanarchist: Here Bobby Fischer establishes a mark that will never be broken: Twenty straight victories with no defeats and no draws against GM competition.> It's a fantastic achievement but it's not the record. Steinitz holds that. |
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| Apr-11-14 | | TheFocus: Steinitz's opponents weren't GMs though. |
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| Apr-11-14 | | ughaibu: Not all of Fischer's were. |
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Apr-11-14
| | offramp: <thegoodanarchist: ...Where they faced a buzz saw never before seen in an IZT, and never since seen again.> The best ever result in an Interzonal was by Alexander Kotov at Stockholm Interzonal (1952); he scored +13 =7, including winning his first eight games,(82.5%) compared to Fischer's outstanding 80.43%. Tal scored about 82% at the Riga Interzonal in 1979 Game Collection: Interzonals 1979: Riga, ((+11 =6 -0). Jan Timman scored 80% as recently as the Taxco Interzonal in 1985. |
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Apr-11-14
 | | perfidious: No use uncritically accepting what <tga> posts, especially as, in this case, it has easily been refuted. As to those title aspirants named by <offramp>, fat lot of good their massive plus scores did them: Kotov finished even at Zurich Candidates (1953), while Tal ran into his personal buzzsaw in Polugaevsky - Tal Candidates Quarterfinal (1980). Timman managed to qualify from Montpellier Candidates (1985) after a playoff with Tal, but went down to Yusupov in the first round. |
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Apr-11-14
| | offramp: Fischer also won Stockholm Interzonal (1962) with a superb score: +13 -0 =9. He finished 2.5 points ahead of Geller & Petrosian. But this seemed to give him unrealistic expectations for the following Candidates' Tournament. He lost his first two games at Curacao and was effectively out of the running right at the start. Winning an Interzonal is not very important; they are designed as qualifiers and that's what players want to do - qualify. |
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| Apr-11-14 | | Petrosianic: <perfidious> <As to those title aspirants named by <offramp>, fat lot of good their massive plus scores did them:> Well, that's a good question. How have Interzonal winners fraed in the Candidates? 1948 - Bronstein: Tied for First in Candidates, drew world championship match 1952 - Kotov: 8th-9th in Candidates, 50% score
1955 - Bronstein: 3rd - 7th in Candidates, +1 score. 1958 - Tal: Won Candidates, won World Championship. Jackpot! 1962 - Fischer: 4th at Candidates, +1 score.
1964 -
Smyslov: Eliminated in Quarterfinals.
Larsen: Eliminated in Semifinals.
Tal: Eliminated in Finals.
Spassky: Won Candidates, lost world championship match 1967 - Larsen: Eliminated in Semifinals.
1970 - Fischer: Won Candidates, won World Championship. Jackpot! 1973 -
Mecking: Eliminated in Quarterfinals.
Korchnoi: Eliminated in Finals.
Karpov: Won Candidates, became World Champion. Jackpot! 1976 -
Larsen: Eliminated in Quarterfinals.
Mecking: Eliminated in Quarterfinals.
1979 -
Petrosian: Eliminated in Quarterfinals.
Portisch: Eliminated in Semifinals.
Huebner: Eliminated in Finals.
Tal: Eliminated in Quarterfinals.
1982 -
Portisch: Eliminated in Quarterfinals.
Torre: Eliminated in Quarterfinals.
Ribli: Eliminated in Semifinals.
Kasparov: Won Candidates, won world championship. Jackpot! 1985-7 -
Vaganian: 1st-3rd in Candidates Tournament.
Eliminated in Quarterfinals.
Yusupov: 1st-3rd in Candidates Tournament. Eliminated in semifinals. Timman: Qualified from Candidates Tournament, eliminated in Quarterfinals. 1988-90
Korchnoi: Eliminated in Octifinals
Sax: Eliminated in Octifinals
Salov: Eliminated in Octifinals
Short: Eliminated in Quarterfinals.
Hjartarson: Eliminated in Quarterfinals.
Speelman: Eliminated in Seminfinals.
So, there's a real mixed bag here. A couple of jackpots, and also a lot of quick exits and mediocre candidates tournament results. But out of 34 Interzonal winners, only 4 went all the way. |
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| Apr-11-14 | | Petrosianic: <offramp>: <compared to Fischer's outstanding 80.43%.
Jan Timman scored 80% as recently as the Taxco Interzonal in 1985.> Well, sort of. Both of those results include one forfeit win. If we count only games played, both are slightly below 80%. Actually, without the forfeit, Fischer's score in 1970 is identical to his score in 1962 (although with one extra win and one extra loss). Kotov and Tal are the only ones to score 80%+ in games actually played in an Interzonal. |
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| Apr-11-14 | | thegoodanarchist: <offramp: < thegoodanarchist: Here Bobby Fischer establishes a mark that will never be broken: Twenty straight victories with no defeats and no draws against GM competition.> It's a fantastic achievement but it's not the record. Steinitz holds that.> Since the GM title hadn't been invented then, I am fairly sure you are wrong. |
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| Apr-11-14 | | RookFile: I think the Fischer vs. Panno game is being brought up here. If you want to split hairs, Panno came to the board after 1. c4 and resigned. That means the game wasn't a forfeit win. |
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| Apr-11-14 | | Petrosianic: <thegoodanarchist:> <Since the GM title hadn't been invented then, I am fairly sure you are wrong.> You're both right... and wrong.
You're right, there was no FIDE GM Title in Steinitz's day. (Steinitz himself wasn't a "GM" in that sense). But you're wrong to say that all of Fischer's wins were against GM's. Some were not. |
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| Apr-11-14 | | Olavi: <RookFile> According to Schach-Echo 24/1970, Fischer's and Reshevsky's last round games were started at 19.00 instead of the scheduled 16.00. Suttles agreed to play at time vs. Reshevsky, Panno didn't. It is stated explicitly that Panno did not appear. |
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| Apr-11-14 | | Petrosianic: I've just gone through the list. Specifically, Rubinetti, Suttles and Mecking were not GM's (although Suttles and Mecking later achieved that title). And of course, Panno was a GM, but they didn't actually play a game. |
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| Apr-11-14 | | RookFile: You can go to the Fischer vs. Panno game, and see keypusher quoting Profile of a Prodigy. <Fischer moved and pushed the clock and then went off to find Panno. Panno came to the playing hall and resigned without waiting for the hour to run out (after which time he would have been forfeited).> Next. |
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| Apr-11-14 | | Olavi: Perhaps. The reporter for SchachEcho was Filip, who played the tournament. Was Brady there? Anyhow, it scarcely matters. |
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| Apr-11-14 | | Petrosianic: So, Anarchist's unspoken question remains. What was Fischer's record specifically against GM's? Answer: 18.
The streak began right after the draw with Polugaevsky, and ended right before the loss to Petrosian. Here are the games played during that period (games that were not OTB wins against GM's in parentheses): Geller - win
Ivkov - win
(Minic - win)
(Jimenez - draw)
(Uitumen - draw)
(Rubinetti - win)
Uhlmann - win
Taimanov - win
(Suttles - win)
(Mecking - win)
Gligoric - win
(Panno - forfeit)
Taimanov x6
Larsen x6
Petrosian
So, Fischer won 18 consecutive games against GM's. The irony is that he actually DREW two games with non-GM's while he was doing it. If we consider any draw to break the streak, then the total is 16. As mentioned, Mecking and Suttles became GM's later, but did not hold that title in 1970. Panno was a GM, but was an unplayed game. |
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| Apr-11-14 | | RookFile: <Was Brady there? > I don't know. Fischer was there - although probably somebody here would debate that point. Brady had Fischer review the book for accuracy, and Fischer had no problem with this account. |
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| Apr-11-14 | | Olavi: <Fischer was there - although probably somebody here would debate that point> I agree, citing an eyewitness writing within days of the event is equivalent to that. |
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Apr-11-14
| | offramp: So under the criteria established by < thegoodanarchist> the record is definitely Steinitz's. |
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| Apr-11-14 | | Petrosianic: Well, if we count only people who held the FIDE GM title, it's Fischer's. If we count consecutive wins in international competition, it's Steinitz. |
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