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Oct-16-20 | | Messiah: What an absolutely TERRIBLE way to lose against Justin! Not knowing what is <distant opposition> was a capital sin in my club, but that was lots of years ago. Awful! This game will haunt the young Ali for a long time, and I am very sorry, but he deserves the nightmares. 69.Kc3 is unexplainable. |
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Oct-16-20 | | Eurotrash: If I lost this way, after hours of excruciatingly hard work, I'd not want to look at a chess board for three months. |
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Oct-16-20 | | Mehzinho: The ending is sad. But what a game of both players and very good of Firouzja to hold it so long. I loved the Knight on b3 and was surprised because I was expecting 36...f5 instead of 36...Nb1 but also the future was bright. For example on f2 it prevents 40.Bxb5 because of the reply Nxe4 with a fantastic placed Knight. I made a 20 min deep vid analysis of this game. Feel free to check it out https://youtu.be/rxTb4HEBZTE |
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Oct-16-20 | | Ulhumbrus: If 7 d4 exposes White to the threat of ...Bg4 two alternatives are 7 h3 and 7 d3. 11 h3 spends a tempo on moving a pawn. Three alternatives are 11 Bg5 ,11 Be3 and 11 Qb3. The question is how White can gain the most from his right to move. Perhaps White can hope for no more than the opening initiative of the first move and is advised to play for no more unless Black gives him cause to play for more. 12 Qxd8+ gives Black's rook a tempo for development but it won't help Black much if a white knight on d5 obstructs the d file. 14 Kg2 spends a tempo. As White has the bishop pair he does not need to play for more than trying to complete his development. The only question is what to do about a black knight on d4. Perhaps 14 Ne2 will be sufficient. 17...Rd6 spends a tempo in one way as the rook is obstructed on the d file by White's knight. However it defends the bishop on f6, and 17...Kg7 would have spent a tempo as well. This suggests that so far Firouxja has kept his initiative. 19 Rfd1? loses time as the black N obstructs the d file and It is not justified in the way that 17...Rd6 is because White's king defends White's knight on f3. Instead of this 19 Rc4 or 19 Rd5 prepares to double rooks on the c file and Black is on the defensive. Perhaps this is the point at which Firouzja begins to let his advantage slip After 24...Rc6 Carlsen has appropriated the initiative on the c file that should have belonged to Firouzja. Now it is Firouzja who has to defend. The computer analysis and evaluations suggest that 69 Kc3?? allows Black to take the opposition and loses at once while 69 Kd2 keeps the distant opposition and draws. |
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Oct-16-20 | | MordimerChess: Sometimes I think Magnus is trolling his opponents. This time opposition masterclass by Magnus: https://youtu.be/UbIMyU3zn18
Enjoy the video analysis! |
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Oct-16-20
 | | Sally Simpson: ***
 click for larger viewSitting opposite Carlsen with a meagre 5 seconds on his clock Firouzja slips in Kc3 and and it's 0-1. Even a slob like me knew Kc3 was wrong. No I'm not joining in the uncalled for Firouzja bashing. If a player of his class drops a clanger like this then it's pure human nerves. It happens. I'll be perfectly honest and say my first reaction was 69.Kc2 ready to play Kc3 in answer to Kc5. 69.Kc2 does draw if Black plays 69...Kc5 I'm wrong. 69.Kc2 also losses. (OOPS!) The Black King has won the opposition battle, it runs around to the Kingside and it is an elementary win. (I had to check on my board why I was wrong. Even then I slightly screwed it up and had to recap....did I say: 'elementary win'...what a bozo.) I too am in the glasshouse, I will not be throwing any stones at this one. Although, as the great Alekhine said, time trouble is not an excuse. (Your clock is the 17th piece. ) it does offer an valid explanation. Firouzja will shrug it off knowing it was a finger slip in the teeth of T.T. and not through any lack of technique. Unlike me who was under no pressure at all. (can 69 years old be offered.) I might just spend an hour or so beefing up on the dark art of King opposition...now where is that Keres book on endgames, I saw it under a film of dust a few years ago. *** |
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Oct-16-20 | | Messiah: <Sally Simpson> 69.Kc2?? runs into 69...Kc6, obviously. |
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Oct-16-20
 | | Williebob: Carlsen told ChessBase that he noticed Firouzja was getting nervous at the end, so he kept playing. Bet we won't see Ali blunder like that again!
^^I like what <Sally> said. Who never blundered once in a serious game?
Magnus proves yet again that he possesses the complete skill set. I don't get the Justin Bieber reference, I mean I get it, but <Mess> you have lost this war! |
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Oct-16-20
 | | offramp: <Mehzinho>I noticed that you and me have the exact same score at chessbookie! |
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Oct-16-20
 | | Sally Simpson: ***
HI Messiah,
Obviously...yup..it's six and two threes ....it's not the only winning line after 69.Kc2. (why am I getting '??' you did not give to Alireza any after his 69.Kc3.) Something must have twigged from the time I was keen and used to look at these things 69.Kc2 Ke6 and the King owning the Kingside is first the line I saw/recalled. As I said my Kc2 was a first reaction, I was being honest. Perhaps trying to answer your <'unexplainable.'> Hopefully with time I may have double checked it. (I did that sometimes) With 5 seconds it would have been a quick 69.Kc2 and a roll of the eyes. Typical, I get two '??' for admitting I too would have blundered and yet Alireza gets nothing but it is 'unexplainable.' Huh! Hi Williebob,
<Who never blundered once in a serious game?> Jacob Aagaard once said my endgame play is just too good for words. Well he never actually said that, he said it left him 'Speechless!' *** |
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Oct-16-20
 | | offramp: <Sally Simpson: ..Even a slob like me knew Kc3 was wrong. No I'm not joining in the uncalled for Firouzja bashing. If a player of his class drops a clanger like this then it's pure human nerves. It happens.> I don't fully agree. For decades I have noticed that GMs are reduced to beginners when it comes to ♔+♙ endings. Those endings are very hard, almost like a separate game, and they need long, focused study to get them right. |
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Oct-16-20
 | | Sally Simpson: ****
Hi offramp,
I'm going with T.T. we have all been there, we know what it's like. The mind goes to jelly as all the potential blunders flash before your eyes. One stray thought and it's over. see Williebob's post:
" Carlsen told ChessBase that he noticed Firouzja was getting nervous at the end, so he kept playing...." I figured on T.T. nerves before seeing that post. All one can do when digging for an explanation is to give an honest opinion based on what ever experience you have. With time on his clock I reckon Firouzja would have dodged the bullet. Regarding GM's playing like beginners in some KP endings. No comment :) *** |
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Oct-16-20 | | tessathedog: What was the time control for this game? Didn’t F have a decent increment, say, 30 seconds, to keep his head cool and avoid such an obvious clanger? |
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Oct-16-20 | | Diademas: < tessathedog: What was the time control for this game? Didn’t F have a decent increment, say, 30 seconds, to keep his head cool and avoid such an obvious clanger?> Google is your friend:
<Time control main game:
Each player will have 120 minutes on the clock with an increment of 10 seconds after move 40. Participant is obliged to record the moves on the score sheet starting from the first move. A player can stop recording the moves when he has less than 5 minutes.>
https://norwaychess.no/en/regulatio... |
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Oct-16-20 | | tessathedog: Thanks Diademas. Well, 10 seconds is considerably more ruthless than 30. An accident is much more likely to occur...and did. Personally, I dislike it when top players aren’t given enough time to think properly. No way would he have played Kc3 if he had been on a proper increment. I don’t think any game with less than a 30 second increment should be deemed to be “classical”, no matter how much capital time one has. It’s clearly rapid at the finish, and anything can happen in rapid. |
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Oct-16-20 | | Justin796: Kc2 runs into ummm Kd4 what are any of you guys talking about? |
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Oct-16-20 | | Justin796: Ah nevermind |
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Oct-16-20
 | | Peligroso Patzer: This blunder by Firouzja is reminiscent of Carlsen’s blunder fourteen years ago (at the 2006 Tal Memorial when Carlsen was age 15 – and almost 16 – when he lost a rook ending to Aronian that is not merely a theoretical draw, but involved theory that should be well-known to every GM: Aronian vs Carlsen, 2006 Of course, this endgame that 17-year-old Firouzja needlessly lost is even more basic theory than the rook endgame Carlsen failed to defend accurately in 2006. Clearly, the explanation by Sally Simpson is correct – sheer nerves when playing on increment. Interestingly, today against Aronian, Carlsen again lost a rook endgame that should have been drawn. In today’s game, Carlsen played 50. Rxf6?? rather hastily in a position that one would expect him to calculate accurately, and suddenly he was lost. (That game from today is not yet in the CG datebase, but will likely be available shortly.) |
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Oct-16-20
 | | Williebob: <Sally Sensei:
Jacob Aagaard once said my endgame play is just too good for words.Well he never actually said that, he said it left him 'Speechless!> That is splendid. Wait, was this serious?! I just noticed the potential self-deprecating joke. Also splendid.
Chess players, you gotta peel back the layers. |
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Oct-16-20 | | SChesshevsky: Yeah, the result should of been a draw. But practically, the odds that Firouzja would draw were probably pretty low. Why? Basically three reasons. First is because of Carlsen's extra pawn, some calculation is necessary. Not only does Firouzja have to worry about opposition in one side but also the chance black's king can swing around with advantage. Or even exchange pawns with advantage. In fact, Polgar was looking at swinging black 's king around with potential at the end. Second, you don't really want to have to rely on significant calculation with less than 30 seconds in the clock. Third, and calculation is going to be very unreliable at the end of a long game at the end of a long tournament. Especially when it's also obvious that your opponent can easily torture you for at least an hour just waiting for a slip or time out. True a tough loss for Firouzja. But maybe more likely than not given the circumstances. |
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Oct-16-20 | | RadioBoy: Why not 69. Kc4 Kc6 71. Kb4? I can't see that
71. f5 wins and what else is there? Evidently I'm missing something really obvious... |
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Oct-16-20 | | RadioBoy: Excuse me, 70. Kb4 f5... |
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Oct-16-20
 | | Peligroso Patzer: <RadioBoy: Why not 69. Kc4 Kc6 71. Kb4? I can't see that
71. f5 wins and what else is there? Evidently I'm missing something really obvious...> <RadioBoy: Excuse me, 70. Kb4 f5..> In the line that you give, <Radio Boy>, after 69. Kc4 if Black continues 69. … Kc6, he is still winning, but the move wastes time. After 69. Kc4, the correct winning plan for Black is to run his king over to the kingside, for example: 69.Kc4 Ke6 70.Kd3 Kf7 71.Ke3 Kg6 72.Kf3 Kh5 73.Kg3 Kg5 And now, Black has the opposition with his king one rank further advanced than with kings on c4 and c6. This makes all the difference, as Black will be able to outflank the white king and thereby win the pawn on e4. Similarly, if White had played 69. Kc2, the correct winning plan for Black would have been to run his king to the kingside. In this line, the move 69. ... Kc6, described as "obvious" in one of the comments, does preserve the win, but simply wastes time. In the game, of course, with 69. Kc3? Kc5, Black obtained the direct opposition with his king on the algebraic 5th rank, so he did not need to take the time to run his king to the kingside, although 69. ... Ke6 would also be winning for Black after Firouzja’s text (69. Kc3?). |
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Oct-19-20 | | Messiah: <Sally Simpson: ***
HI Messiah,
Obviously...yup..it's six and two threes ....it's not the only winning line after 69.Kc2. (why am I getting '??' you did not give to Alireza any after his 69.Kc3.) Something must have twigged from the time I was keen and used to look at these things 69.Kc2 Ke6 and the King owning the Kingside is first the line I saw/recalled. As I said my Kc2 was a first reaction, I was being honest. Perhaps trying to answer your <'unexplainable.'> Hopefully with time I may have double checked it. (I did that sometimes) With 5 seconds it would have been a quick 69.Kc2 and a roll of the eyes. Typical, I get two '??' for admitting I too would have blundered and yet Alireza gets nothing but it is 'unexplainable.' Huh! [...]> I think you severely misunderstood me. Firouzja's move was equally '??', and there is nothing personal against you. These moves are simply losing, and - certainly - you understand and already understood it yourself, long before I commented. Apologies for the terrible wording of my commentary, it was very misleading. |
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Jan-13-21
 | | al wazir: 68. Kd2 also preserves the distant opposition. |
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