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| Dec-02-14 | | Jim Bartle: There was a high kickoff last night which had it been five yards shorter, the kicking team could have caught the ball. So <PB>, you're saying <OCF> is wrong when he says the kickoff is a live ball? I just don't see how a live ball can be fair caught. |
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Dec-02-14
 | | OhioChessFan: Just making the point that it goes without saying a fair catch signal on a kickoff doesn't negate the fact it's a live ball. If it did, a team expecting an onside kick could simply line up and everyone signal fair catch and the ball would be dead. I have seen teams try the popup kickoff, generally trying to get it about 20 yards downfield, just past the initial wave of receivers. Never saw it come close to working. |
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| Dec-02-14 | | Jim Bartle: <Just making the point that it goes without saying a fair catch signal on a kickoff doesn't negate the fact it's a live ball. If it did, a team expecting an onside kick could simply line up and everyone signal fair catch and the ball would be dead.> That's my point. No kicker has been able to, or tried to, kick it high and short enough for a teammate to catch it on the fly. |
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Dec-02-14
 | | WannaBe: <Jim Bartle> Now, I am getting a bit annoyed at you... (I don't think you bothered to read any of the links I spent time lookin' and posting) Next time you have a question, google it yourself. Read #4 of the NFL.com link, and you will notice that kickers always bounce the ball on an on-side kick. |
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Dec-02-14
 | | WannaBe: Here, read this article (Q & A) from 2011:
http://www.49erswebzone.com/forum/n... |
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| Dec-02-14 | | Jim Bartle: I never mentioned bouncing kicks. My example was the kick fair caught last night on about the 40 yard line. Players from the kicking team were pretty close to the ball when it came down. That 49ers link still doesn't answer my question. OK, a player made a fair catch on a kickoff? What if an opponent had been right there? It's a live ball, can he go for it? Someday a kicker will learn to kick the ball high and about 15 yards. Then the rule will need to be clarified. |
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Dec-02-14
 | | WannaBe: If the ball does <NOT> touch the ground, you can signal fair catch. Whether the ball travels 60 yards or 10 yards. Hence, in an expected on-side kick situation, coach(es) always put in the all-hands team and some of the smarter players who know the details of the game. Else receiving team can always call a time out (if they have one) and make sure the Special Team knows what to do in case something unexpected happens. |
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| Dec-02-14 | | Jim Bartle: OK then. So there are limits on saying a kickoff is a "live ball." |
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Dec-02-14
 | | WannaBe: The ball can be touched by the receiving team at any time, for the kicking team it must go 10 yards or more. |
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Dec-02-14
 | | Phony Benoni: <JB> As I understand this, you think it unfair that a receiving team can, by calling for a fair catch, deny the kicking team a chance to recover a live ball. Well, it doesn't have to be fair. it's a rule.
Seriously, this seems to be one of those arbitrary decisions between arguable alternatives. Why, for instance, should simultaneous possession favor the receiver? In the situation you describe the current ruling seems clear to me, and I'm not sure what needs to be clarified. |
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| Dec-02-14 | | Jim Bartle: I don't think it's unfair. I just think two different rules clash, and might cause a big problem in the future. As I understand it from comments, a player on the receiving team can call a fair catch and no player on the kicking team can jump and catch it. This is really unlikely, but like the "fourth out" in baseball, has the potential to lead to a controversy sometime in the future. |
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Dec-02-14
 | | WannaBe: This is from 2010, I don't know if the rule have been further amended/changed or not. But I think it's rather 'stupid'. In my opinion, once the ball touches the receiver and <IS NOT SECURED> it should be fair game. Example, once a ball is tipped (at the line of scrimmage) there is no pass inteference anymore. Once a ball is touched/blocked on a punt, the kicker is no longer eligible for Roughing the Kicker penalty. http://www.bleedinggreennation.com/... So, let's say, for the sake of argument, I signal a fair catch, and of course, being all thumbs and alligator arm, the ball bounces off my chest and goes up in the air. I don't see why the gunners can't jump ball it. (Think basketball tip-off) But have to wait for me and give me a chance to recover my own muff/fumble. |
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| Dec-02-14 | | Jim Bartle: That rule goes against everything a player has learned since he started playing. Once he muffs the ball everyone should be able to go after it. |
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Dec-03-14
 | | WannaBe: http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/1... Maybe they should both restart their franchise... |
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| Dec-03-14 | | Jim Bartle: A devious plot by the Sixers to win a game. They'd play, "lose," then point out the baskets were wrong. I saw a really nice interview with Popovich praising the Sixers and their coaches for playing hard and tough under difficult circumstances. |
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Dec-03-14
 | | OhioChessFan: <So, let's say, for the sake of argument, I signal a fair catch, and of course, being all thumbs and alligator arm, the ball bounces off my chest and goes up in the air. I don't see why the gunners can't jump ball it. > How do you distuinguish between a person not completely securing the punt, eg a small bobble where it might leave their grasp for a half second, and a ball that bounces 8 feet high? I can't think of a plausible way to write the rule that would be reasonable to enforce for both sides. |
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Dec-03-14
 | | WannaBe: Okay, so after that restart, Philly won!! (Maybe they should restart more often) http://scores.espn.go.com/nba/recap... |
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Dec-04-14
 | | keypusher: <WannaBe: Okay, so after that restart, Philly won!! (Maybe they should restart more often)> Some smart aleck tweeted that it was like watching the Washington Generals play themselves. |
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Dec-04-14
 | | keypusher: <Jim Bartle et al.> Re WannaBe's post about having the ball bounce on onside kicks, here is an article about former Dolphins kicker Olindo Mare, who was great at driving the ball and making it pop up in the air. I couldn't find any video, though. <http://articles.orlandosentinel.com...> |
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Dec-04-14
 | | WannaBe: Amazing how often the Generals fall for the pull down the shorts trick. Have the Generals ever fire their coach for lack of "winning attitude"? What exactly does the General Manager look for in a player while scouting? "Man, that dude is sulking, again, he'll be a great fit on our team." While we are on the subject of the Generals, what DO they discuss during a time-out? "Hey, watch out for that ball on the string trick", "When they start that 5-men weave, don't just stand there, AGAIN!!", "I swear, if you let them shoot that half-court three again, I'm gonna trade you the Chinese Basketball League!" |
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| Dec-04-14 | | Jim Bartle: Generals say, "Just wait until we play them at home." |
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Dec-04-14
 | | WannaBe: Quite a drive by Dallas, converted 2 fourth down plays... |
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Dec-05-14
 | | WannaBe: You know what that big 'N' on the side of the helmet represent? Nowledge!
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaaf... |
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Dec-05-14
 | | WannaBe: Rain a little bit earlier, still (very) dark clouds over head. Could be a wet Pac-12 Championship Game by half time. |
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Dec-06-14
 | | OhioChessFan: Playing Through:
http://www.nbcsports.com/golf/pga/w... |
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