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| Nov-16-10 | | nescio: <rapidcitychess: On this game P Vaitonis vs E Eliskases, 1933 it seems a bit blunderous to be for the great Erich. Are you sure this game is good?> If you had checked yourself in some other databases (http://db.mychess.com/, http://www.newinchess.com/NICBase/ to name a few) you would have seen that they have the identical, or almost identical, game, so there is no reason to doubt its genuinity. <It might also need to be rejected for purely quality errors too.> I don't think it is the job of a database to reject games because of poor quality, as long as they were played by established masters, which Vaitonis and Eliskases certainly were, however young they may have been at the time. |
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Nov-16-10
 | | Domdaniel: <Vaitonis vs Eliskases> I agree with Nescio. Olimpbase has the score ending with 15.f4 1-0, and the comment "and White won in a few moves, source British Chess Magazine 1833, p.461." This was Eliskases's only loss, and came in the first round against a strong Lithuanian team. Olimbase refers to a disappointing Austrian performance at the Folkestone olympiad, adding that the teenaged Eliskases was prone to drawing (W.4, D.8, L.1 on board 2). Vaitonis won 5 games, beating well-known players such as Dunkelblum and Thomas. This was a bad blunder by Eliskases, but plausible. |
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| Nov-16-10 | | rapidcitychess: BTW, I don't have a database, I probably would of checked if I did. |
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| Nov-16-10 | | rapidcitychess: I must of been mistaken thinking there was a quality needed for a game, unless it was of important historic signifcance. This might be important. |
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| Nov-16-10 | | nescio: <rapidcitychess: BTW, I don't have a database, I probably would of checked if I did.> I doubt it. You didn't even take the trouble to click on the links <Phony Benoni> and I gave. |
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| Nov-16-10 | | rapidcitychess: <nescio>
I try not to get lost clicking on links. And how would you know if I click on links? |
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| Nov-16-10 | | nescio: <rapidcitychess>
Because if you had you would have seen that they are online databases. You don't have to own them, you can just use them. But never mind. If you don't want to learn something by clicking on useful links, you don't. |
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Nov-17-10
 | | chessgames.com: Stop with the bickering, please. We're all on the same team here. |
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Nov-17-10
| | chessgames.com: <rapidcitychess: It might also need to be rejected for purely quality errors too. Thanks.> and from the game page <rapidcitychess: 14....e6???? Could this be rejected for quality errors?> You seem to misunderstand our policy on game quality. If a game is played by a notable player, then it's a must-have for our database in spite of how many blunders were made. By "notable player" we mean: (A) A player who has a master rating (FIDE 2200 or more, or the equivalent strength in the pre-ratings era) even if he or she was not a master when the game took place. (B) Anybody of historical importance (e.g. Albert Einstein, or Alan Turing) (C) Anybody who lived prior to 1800 (an extension of rule B above, because these game scores are so hard to find) (D) Anybody participating in a major chess event that is not an "open". (Case in point: due to a loophole in the qualification process a relatively low rated player found themselves in the US Championship a year or two back. We would never delete their games.) Once one of the players (not necessarily both!) is established as a "notable player" by that definition, we want the game, whether or not it has lots of blunders, or the player was very young, or blindfolded, or sick, or drunk, or whatever the explanation. That's not to say we refuse/delete any game that doesn't involve notable players; that just means we automatically want games that do involve notable players. Reasons for including games of unknown players are extensive, including tactics suitable for puzzles, illustrations of common errors, anything unusual about the game (multiple promotions, say), or just a rare but interesting opening variation. Occasionally we delete games due to lack of quality, usually from Under-12 tournament and the like, and we avoid deleting games that have kibitzing or are found in game collections. So the enforcement of this rule goes on mostly behind the scenes with games that nobody is paying any attention to anyhow. About the game in question, P Vaitonis vs E Eliskases, 1933, while admittedly not very sound chess, the opening variation fits into the "rare and interesting" category. Our main concern now is just to make sure it's attributed to the right players. |
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| Nov-17-10 | | bharatiy: Is there a page to discuss FIDE in general. We tend to discuss FIDE at odd pages, can you have a dedicated page for FIDE and/ OR for world championships in general. Thank You. If you already have it thank you for directing me towards those. |
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| Nov-17-10 | | rapidcitychess: <Chessgames.com>
Thanks for clearing that up. I really appreciate the work you are doing! |
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Nov-17-10
| | chessgames.com: <bharatiy: Is there a page to discuss FIDE in general?> Well the The Kibitzer's Café is the ultimate catch-all, but usually for specific purposes like that our members find a logical place to go. For example people use the Arpad Elo page to discuss chess ratings in general, not because of any decision made by the Chessgames management, rather a democratic decision reached by a consensus of Chessgames members. But where to discuss FIDE? That's a good question. It's a shame Ilyumzhinov doesn't have any published games or we'd have a player page for him and the answer would be obvious. On a few occasions we've made a player page even though there are no games behind it, but that sort of thing is very rare. If we did that for Kirsan you'd have an obvious place to discuss FIDE, and it also would make Ilyumzhinov on par with Santa Claus ;-) The best solution would be if somebody could locate a chess game known to be played by Ilyumzhinov. He took first place in Kalmykian national chess championship in 1976, when he was only 14, and later became a stronger player still. Surely there must exist some record of his chess somwhere. If somebody can do that, we would be greatly in your debt. |
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| Nov-17-10 | | nescio: <But where to discuss FIDE?> Without bickering, I would suggest the player page of someone from the early history of FIDE. I remember that Alexander Rueb was FIDE's first president, but the actual founder of the organization might be even better. |
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| Nov-17-10 | | bharatiy: I am using Florencio Campomanes's page as of now. may be we will in general decide a better place later! |
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| Nov-17-10 | | crawfb5: <The best solution would be if somebody could locate a chess game known to be played by Ilyumzhinov. He took first place in Kalmykian national chess championship in 1976, when he was only 14, and later became a stronger player still. Surely there must exist some record of his chess somwhere. If somebody can do that, we would be greatly in your debt.> Ask and ye shall receive.
[Event "Soviet Union tt"]
[Site ""]
[Date "1978.??.??"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Zakharov, Alexander Vladimirovich"]
[Black "Ilyumzhinov, Kirsan"]
[Result "1-0"]
[NIC "QO 14.16"]
[ECO "D51"]
[PlyCount "57"]
1. d4 d5 2. c4 e6 3. Nc3 Nf6 4. Bg5 Nbd7 5. e3 Be7 6. Nf3 Ne4 7. Bxe7 Qxe7 8. cxd5
Nxc3 9. bxc3 exd5 10. Bd3 O-O 11. O-O Nf6 12. Qc2 g6 13. Rfe1 c5 14. c4 dxc4 15.
Bxc4 Bf5 16. Qb3 Rab8 17. dxc5 Qxc5 18. Rac1 Qe7 19. Nd4 Bd7 20. e4 Qe5 21. Nf3 Qf4
22. g3 Qh6 23. e5 Ne8 24. e6 fxe6 25. Bxe6 Bxe6 26. Qxe6 Kh8 27. Ne5 Qg7 28. Nd7
Qf7 29. Qxf7 1-0
I also submitted it via the PGN upload utility page, if you're so inclined to process some of the backlog... :-) |
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| Nov-17-10 | | computer chess guy: World Cup XI (ICCF correspondence event), games available from http://www.iccf-webchess.com/GetEve... |
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Nov-18-10
| | chessgames.com: Well done crawfb5! We finally have a page on Kirsan Ilyumzhinov. We found a very nice photo from Wikimedia. Our job here is done, we'll leave the volunteer biographers to their job. |
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| Nov-18-10 | | Eyal: <CG> The Tal Memorial blitz tournament - as usual in blitz tournaments - has many corrupt scores: incomplete games, or sequences of moves that don't make sense. But now, quite a lot of them may be reconstructed with the help of videos of these games, posted mostly at http://www.youtube.com/user/bumbleb... Here are a couple that I had a chance to go over:
Nakamura vs Carlsen, 2010, after 32.Bxf4, goes
<32...Nd3 33. Rf1 Nxf4 34. Rxf4 Qe6 35. Qe1 Qe5 36. Qg3 Nc5 37. Ne3 Be6 38. Rf2 Qxg3+ 39. Kxg3 Kg8 40. Kf3 Rd2 41. Re2 Kf7 42. Kf2 Bb3 43. Bxb3+ Nxb3 44. Ra3 Nc1 45. Rxd2 Rxd2+ 46. Kf3 Ke6 47. Nf5 g6 48. Nd4+ Kd6 49. Ra1 Rd3+ 50. Kf2 Rxc3 51. Nc6 Nd3+ 52. Ke2 Nc5 53. Rd1+ Ke6 54. Rd4 Ra3 55. Nd8+ Ke7 56. Nc6+ Kf7 57. Nd8+ Ke8 58. Nc6 Rxa4 59. Rd8+ Kf7 60. Rc8 Ne6 61. Ke3 Rc4 62. Rh8 Kg7 63. Re8 Nc5 64. e5 fxe5 65. Re7+ Kf6 66. Rxc7 Rc3+ 67. Kd2 Rg3 68. Rxh7 Rxg2+ 69. Kc3 Ne4+ 70. Kd3 Nd6 71. Rd7 Rg3+ 72. Kd2 Nxb5 73. Rb7 Nd6 74. Rd7 Ne4+ 75. Ke2 Rxh3 76. Rb7 Rb3 77. Nxa5 Nc5 0-1> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKJ4...
Nakamura vs M Vachier-Lagrave, 2010, after 42.Qd4, goes <42...Qg3 43. Bg4 Rc2 44. Rxc2 Rxc2 45. Qg1 Qf4 46. Re1 Bd3 0-1> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1kbh... |
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| Nov-18-10 | | Eyal: Btw, did you actually find that Mikhail A Botvinnik has a middle name that begins with an 'A' or just added it arbitrarily to distinguish him from the famous player? I'm curious because I saw what you wrote here about the problem and checked some Hebrew records of the Israeli Chess Federation, but couldn't find any middle name... |
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| Nov-19-10 | | chessmoron: <Chessgames> Would you mind creating a forum for Asian Games: Chess event especially getting PGN for classical chess just like in 2006. http://www.chess.co.uk/twic/chessne... |
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Nov-19-10
| | chessgames.com: <Mikhail A Botvinnik> That was actually a mistake--an admin temporarily used that name during the correction process--a handy trick to avoid going nutty when your screen is filled with two different Mikhail Botvinniks. By accident he didn't switch it back. We have no reason to believe his middle name starts with an A, and it should be corrected. <chessmoron> Sure, we'd love to have those games. Thanks for the link. |
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Nov-19-10
 | | SwitchingQuylthulg: <chessgames.com> Just noticed something weird when I searched for the word "move": Search Kibitzing It says there are 19936 pages (people are saying "move" a lot, so there may be more by the time you read this...), yet the last pages - nine or so in this case - are totally empty. I soon discovered the same is true for other ultra-popular words, such as "White" (17 empty pages at the end) and "Black" (18 empty pages). What's up with that? |
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| Nov-19-10 | | NakoSonorense: <SwitchingQ> You read my mind. I was about to ask the same question. It happened with words like "chess," "win," and "game." |
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Nov-20-10
| | chessgames.com: <What's up with that?> It's not too surprising that you can stress the software by making searches like that, but what exactly is going on is unclear without further investigation. We'll probably make some filter that gives the generic "please make a more specific search" error when you try things like that. Thanks for pointing it out. |
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Nov-20-10
| | SwitchingQuylthulg: <chessgames.com: We'll probably make some filter that gives the generic "please make a more specific search" error when you try things like that.> If you do that, do it carefully or it could be a serious inconvenience to some users - "acirce" is one of the words this happens with, and if he can't search for his own username anymore... ;-) |
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