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| Aug-22-12 | | Everett: <achieve, perfidious> BTW, Smyslov was top 10 from '42-'72, a ridiculous 30 years. One of the very greatest players ever. |
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| Aug-22-12 | | Everett: Does anyone know the story of why Bondarevsky was not working with Spassky for the '72 match? And how he was back on for vs Karpov in '74? |
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| Aug-22-12 | | Eyal: Re Stein – he was the biggest victim of the rule from 1959 that only three players of the same country were allowed to be seeded into the Candidates, and overall perhaps the most unlucky player in the history of the Interzonals. In 1962 (http://www.mark-weeks.com/chess/616...) he finished shared 6-8 and won a tiebreak playoff, but didn’t qualify because there were three other Soviets ahead of him (apparently he entered the playoff knowing that even if he wins it would allow him only to become a first replacement). In 1964 (http://www.mark-weeks.com/chess/646...) he wasn’t among the six that qualified for the candidates even though he finished clear 5th. In 1967 (http://www.mark-weeks.com/chess/676...) he again finished shared 6-8 and played a tiebreak playoff. This time he *would* have qualified to the candidates if he won, and he could have done it had he accepted a draw offer on move 11 by Hort in the final round game (Stein vs Hort, 1968), but he rejected it and eventually lost. And in 1973 he qualified for the Petropolis Interzonal, but died of a heart attack shortly before it started. |
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| Aug-22-12 | | EdZelli: Eggman, achieve and all,
60's were truly the golden age of Chess.
Sigh ! I miss em all, Tal, Geller, Bobby, Tigran, Gligoric, Larsen, ... Best regards, |
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| Aug-22-12 | | Eyal: <Everett: Does anyone know the story of why Bondarevsky was not working with Spassky for the '72 match?> According to the testimony of Nikolai Krogius (quoted in the book <Russians versus Fischer>), there was a falling out between Sapssky and Bondarevsky in the period before the match because Bondarevsky kept reprimanding him for not working hard enough (he also spoke about his concerns with the Sports Committee), and because he thought Spassky was making too many concessions to Fischer in the pre-match negotiations. From another direction, Geller - who wanted very much to take Bondarevsky's place as head-trainer - kept discrediting him, constantly talking to Spassky about B.'s lack of knowledge in opening theory and detachment from practical play. |
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| Aug-22-12 | | achieve: <there was a falling out between Sapssky and Bondarevsky in the period before the match> Please, <Eyal>, and do not repost and delete this one -- the typo is a true classic, I laughed my proverbial arse off when I read the Sapssky line... :D Probably because of the funny meaning of the word 'sap' in Dutch... Just saying |
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| Aug-22-12 | | achieve: <Everett: <achieve, perfidious> BTW, Smyslov was top 10 from '42-'72, a ridiculous 30 years. One of the very greatest players ever.> So true -- just reading the reactions from various people here you can just feel the warmth and admiration when talking about that golden era, great characters, some Soviet-West intrigue at times, but most of all the tremendously gifted and creative qualities spring to mind. Unintruded by the "computer age", thank goodness. <30 years in the top 10> Stunning, I wonder how long Timman stayed in the top (10); must be 20 years, perhaps, between 1975 and 1995... But haven't looked it up yet. |
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| Aug-22-12 | | achieve: The Smyslov longevity at the top sage actually approaches never before seen heights, as Smyslov, aged over 60, managed to reach the Candidates Final against Garri Kasparov, re-astablishing himself, already following his semi final win over Ribli, once again among the top <10> of the world, <45> years after becoming a top 10 player, and in '54 becoming the undisputed #1 in the world. Staggering to see his performance graph over a period of some 50 years. http://www.chessmetrics.com/cm/CM2/... |
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| Aug-22-12 | | RookFile: Another way of interpreting that is to say that when Fischer dropped out of chess, there was a decline of interest in the game for some 10 years - until Kasparov showed up with his dynamic style of play and got people interested again. If Smyslov did well, it may have been because he didn't have to play a great young talent before he hit Kasparov. Soltis wrote about Karpov that unfortunately, he was the best we had for 10 years, even if his style of play then would put you to sleep. |
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| Aug-22-12 | | Petrosianic: Smyslov was never very far from the top. He didn't make some miracle comeback from obscurity in 1983. Even though he didn't appear in the 1968, 1971, 1974, 1977 or 1980 Candidates, he missed qualification by like a half point every time he tried. |
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Aug-22-12
 | | harrylime: Wow.Some great posts and a timeless debate to boot. What irks me about Boris is his decline after the 60's .. it's as if wresting the title off Petrosian was it for him.. after 1970 he just was'nt the same player. Fischer played a diminished Spassky in '72, and Karpov met an even greater diminished Spassky in '74.. I think the Spassky of the mid 60's, hungry and motivated, set against Fischer in either '69 or '72, would've produced a very close and titanic match. |
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Aug-22-12
 | | perfidious: < Everett: <achieve, perfidious> BTW, Smyslov was top 10 from '42-'72, a ridiculous 30 years. One of the very greatest players ever.> Introducing the man who gets my vote as the greatest player of the 1950s. There's nothing to add to what others have said here, so I'll leave it at that. |
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Aug-22-12
| | harrylime: <RookFile> I do believe there was indeed a vacume in chess in the 70's after Fischer's self implosion and the disappearance of many great players form the previous decades.. Karpov looked stronger and more impressive because of this vacume. As indeed did Korchnoi. |
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| Aug-22-12 | | achieve: Ivanchuk and Anand stormed the world ranking in '86 and '88, and look at them still going, also approaching a 25 pushing 30 years at the very top. Smyslov though, is "hors categorie", perhaps only near him is Botwinnik himself, Karpov (??)- and Sammy Reshevsky's longevity is remarkable, but nowhere near the heights of Botwinnik and Smyslov. We're talking 45 years here, just as a reminder. |
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Aug-22-12
| | perfidious: <achieve: Ivanchuk and Anand stormed the world ranking in '86 and '88, and look at them still going, also approaching a 25 pushing 30 years at the very top....> With greater psychological stability, Ivanchuk could have lifted himself into the group of titleholders. Anand finally overcame the spectre of Kasparov and hoisted himself to the very peak. <....Sammy Reshevsky's longevity is remarkable, but nowhere near the heights of Botwinnik and Smyslov....> Reshevesky's career is testimony to the virtue of sheer determination combined with immense talent. |
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| Aug-22-12 | | Everett: <Eyal> Thanks for the heads up on Bondarevsky. I feel it is guys like him, Furman, Boleslavsky, Koblentz, etc., that really bring something special to the game, and to the play of their charges. |
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Aug-22-12
| | perfidious: <Everett> Furman was one fine player as well, though he never played much outside the Iron Curtain. As a trainer, utterly brilliant. |
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| Aug-22-12 | | Everett: <perfidious> Everyone up and down, from Karpov to Bronstein, had nothing but great things to say about Furman. Bronstein's Gothenburg '55 result was likely possible due to Furman's work as his second. |
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Aug-22-12
| | harrylime: lol .. this is turning into some kind of creepy 'lovein' ! Spassky is a very great player.He did what he had to do,namely become world chess champion. Unfortunately he was playing chess in a period frothing over with great players .. His struggle to attain the chess crown should reflect this .. And ofcourse his peak coincided with Robert Fischers' .. They were on a collision course.. Just like out there in the universe, when a stellar explosion occurs, things get knocked off their orbit. Spassky got knocked off his orbit after his encounter with Fischer... With Fischer's supernova a black hole ensued.. Karpov filled this.. his only opposition being a tired old star from the 60's and 50's... |
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| Aug-22-12 | | bharatiy: there seems to be more info about Spass kyhttp://whychess.org/en/node/2820 |
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| Aug-22-12 | | RookFile: It was said of Furman that he was world champion strength with the white pieces. Certainly a great guy to train against when you're preparing a black defense. |
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Aug-22-12
| | perfidious: <Eyal> No getting away from it, Stein got hosed by the rules in force at the time. It's unfortunate that we'll never know and have to live with only speculation as to what might have been. From Petropolis 1973, Stein may well have qualified: it was clearly a weaker field than Leningrad, where anyone would have had a tough time. Drop any of the top four finishers from Petropolis (Mecking, Polugaevsky, Portisch and Geller) into a spot at Leningrad and there was a fair chance they'd have missed out in my opinion-I remember Larsen complaining at what he perceived as the disparity in strength between the lineups. In my mind, this makes Robert Byrne's qualification all the more impressive-the Leningrad event was brutal. |
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Aug-22-12
| | harrylime: All this debate..
Boris, I hope you are well.
I always thought you were enjoying the life which France has to offer |
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Aug-22-12
 | | Eggman: <<In my mind, this makes Robert Byrne's qualification all the more impressive-the Leningrad event was brutal.>> Yes, and Byrne very nearly qualified for the candidates again in the following cycle. |
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| Aug-22-12 | | Everett: ..and Larsen never forgave Euwe for putting him in the "Soviet" Interzonal in two different cycles. Even when Euwe was on his deathbed. As told in Seirawan's Chess Duels... |
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