< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 24 OF 24 ·
|Sep-19-12|| ||Petrosianic: We not only don't know if Keres said it. If he did, we don't know WHEN he said it. It was at the 1964 Interzonal that Larsen said he said it. Keres wasn't in that tournament, so if it happened at all, Larsen was relaying an old comment. Who knows how old?|
I find the comment very dubious. "Player A says he could beat Player B" is a common type of comment. But "Player A says he can beat Player B, and the match would be [exactly this long], and the final score would be [this much to this much]" is pretty wild.
|Sep-20-12|| ||TheFocus: Kinda hard to believe Paul saying that.
Keres: "Yes, I have a minus score against little Bobby, but I bet you I could beat him in a match by a score of 8-3! What do you think, Bag of Tricks?"
Tal: "Maybe in your dreams, Paulie. For that idiotic remark, you buy the next round."
|Sep-20-12|| ||RookFile: I saw it in Chess Life. Need somebody with access to old issues.|
|Sep-20-12|| ||TheFocus: <Need somebody with access to old issues.>|
I have them all. 1964?
|Sep-21-12|| ||ughaibu: Honza Cervenka: What about Moscow 1964?|
|Sep-21-12|| ||brankat: To make that kind of a statement, even in private, let alone public, would have been very much out of character for one P.P.Keres. He had always been a perfect gentleman.|
|Sep-22-12|| ||Honza Cervenka: <ughaibu: Honza Cervenka: What about Moscow 1964?>|
I was listing only some of Geller's results, where he finished on the podium or (in team events) where he performed very well. Of course, there were some tournaments, where Geller's result was not so shining, and Moscow zonal 1964 was arguably his worst tournament in the 1960s with 5/12 and the last, 7th place.
|Sep-22-12|| ||ughaibu: Okay, I see.|
|Nov-03-12|| ||Conrad93: Wow, so many draws...|
|Nov-17-12|| ||Cemoblanca: RIP Grand Master!|
|Nov-18-12|| ||Conrad93: The only player who seemed vastly superior to Geller was Korchnoi.|
|Nov-18-12|| ||Cemoblanca: Very interesting stuff <Conrad93>.|
According to the database, Viktor Korchnoi beat Efim Geller 11 to 6, with 15 draws.
I'll check this out now! ;)
|Nov-18-12|| ||Conrad93: The funny thing is that Geller was unable to beat Korchnoi in his later years. It seems like Korchnoi developed faster than his rival.|
|Nov-18-12|| ||perfidious: <Conrad93><....It seems like Korchnoi developed faster than his rival.>|
Is that right? Geller played two candidates tournaments (1953 and 1956) before they played together at Curacao, Korchnoi's debut at that level.
Do you ever check facts before blathering on with your foolishness?
|Nov-19-12|| ||Conrad93: Yes, I do check facts. After their early years were over Geller, never managed to win a single game against Korchnoi.|
The truth is that after 1960 Geller was a patzer compared to Korchnoi.
|Nov-19-12|| ||Conrad93: I find it remarkable how a patzer like Geller managed to beat Fischer during his peak. Fischer must have either been mad or drunk.|
No disrespect to Geller, of course. He was relatively weak compared to his competition, but still a decent player.
|Nov-19-12|| ||brankat: <Conrad93>
Patzer Geller was a Candidate six times, over a period of some 20 years.
He had beaten 8 (eight) World Champions. Only 3 other GMs managed to accomplish the same (Bobby is not one of them).
He had a positive overall result against 5 W.Champions. (Bobby didn't).
<The truth is that after 1960 Geller was a patzer compared to Korchnoi.>
The Truth is that you know very little about chess, and even less about chess History.
<I find it remarkable how a patzer like Geller managed to beat Fischer during his peak. Fischer must have either been mad or drunk.>
If you had studied their games you would not have found it remarkable, but quite natural. Geller had found a dent in Booby's armor, and Fischer found it hard to protect himself. It was similar against Tal and Korchnoi.
And, no, at the time Fischer was not mad, neither did he drink.
Btw, when do you plan to start learning?
|Nov-19-12|| ||RookFile: Korchnoi or Geller? How about Keres, he beat both of them.|
|Nov-19-12|| ||Nosnibor: <brankat><Conrad93>To put the position into a proper perspective Gellers positive results against World Champions were:Smyslov +11=34-7 Petrosian +6=33-2 Botvinnik +4=5-1 Fischer +5=2-3 Thus making 4 positive results.Against Tal he scored equally +6=23-6.His remaining results against the other three WC`s are:-Spassky +6=22 -9 Karpov+1=5-2 and Kasparov +0 =3-1.Giving an overall total of+39=127-31.His negative results came in the later years of his life.No other GM that I am aware of has prformed so well against WCs over an active chess period of 50 years.|
|Nov-19-12|| ||maxi: Such stats (if true) make a strong case for Geller's strength.|
According to the CG database, Geller-Keres stats are +7 =21 -10.
|Nov-19-12|| ||RookFile: I see what you mean. Geller was so strong that he lost a match to Keres and had a lifetime negative score against him. |
Geller defeats 8 world champions, Keres defeats 9.
The moral of the story is, if you do less than the other guy, you're a stronger player.
|Nov-19-12|| ||maxi: Nope. I was emphasizing what I have said in the past, that Keres was a very tough customer.|
|Nov-19-12|| ||RookFile: I thought your post was fine, maxi. Thanks.|
|Nov-19-12|| ||maxi: I realized you were kidding, but also that my post had been overly laconic and unclear.|
|Nov-19-12|| ||notyetagm: <wordfunph: 1970 The USSR Versus The World:
At one time during his game, Efim Geller had three cigarettes going simultaneously.|
Geller putting on a simul. :-)
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